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The Forum > Article Comments > On Rudd’s prognostications > Comments

On Rudd’s prognostications : Comments

By Greg Barns and Daniel Liptak, published 6/2/2009

One should always beware of leaders like Rudd who use their position to behave as some sort of saviour.

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The authors are blowing hot air with dash of forced outrage.
It's always easy to find problems with someone else's plan, what are the solutions fellas. More importantly the authors themselves show they haven't got a handle on things when they suggest that the oil price is a result of lower demand. The price of oil is only loosely based on demand at the best of times but in the last few years this has been even less so. Can either of these guys show some evidence that a lot less oil is benign used now then say from one year ago.
Posted by Kenny, Friday, 6 February 2009 9:32:26 AM
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Quite simply Rudd is a populist, who likes doing the popular things, he is like a 10 yo who is trying to buy friends with his money.

He has to blame someone for the recession we had to have.

Now he cannot blame the person who keep saying "the inflation genie is out of the bottle" which help the RBA to raised interest rate too far. He cannot blame Wayne Swann, his treasurer who 5 months after the credit crises orignated in Nove 07, was encourage all of us to stop spening, so that the lack of economic activity helped worsen our economy, to the point that we are in a recession.

He also cannot blame his Democrate mates in the US, who told banks to lend to minority, who did not have the ability to repay, which caused the housing bubble and credit crisis in the first place. The smae people who created Frannie Mae and Freddie Mac in the first place. Because by increasing the first home grant, he is doing the same thing in Australia.

So it cannot be Rudd who is to be blamed, so lets blame it on the faceless monster, lets blame it on .... extreme capitalism

No one in this world want to be called an extreme capitalist, so Rudd won't be offending anyone who might vote for him.... and he can blame someone else for the problem
Posted by dovif2, Friday, 6 February 2009 10:06:56 AM
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Greg & Daniel,

Is it any less disingenuous of you to couch this piece in terms of a parliamentary question time theatrical attack to make some political point?

Are you suggesting that either that Howard et al wouldn’t do the same? It’s called politics and yes politics sucks. Especially how both sides focus on caricatures of the facts presented in emotional terms of the less informed. Your article does the same to divert attention your self interested motivation.

If you have a real criticism of the substance might I suggest you post it in less biased and hysterical political/self interested terms?

BTW your line about the system working is somewhat hollow given that in essence the crisis causes were two fold an uncontrolled credit bubble and uncontrolled derivatives market (arguably uncontrolled financial industry [aka unregulated capitalism] **created** crisis). Therefore your faux concern for the suffering financial less well off is disingenuous at best and callously/wantonly self-serving at worst.

NB I'm no particular fan of the ALP or Rudd.
Posted by examinator, Friday, 6 February 2009 10:17:27 AM
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The credit crunch was caused by Greenspan who let the money supply rip in the US during his tenure. Finally Americans are waking up to what a disaster he was. The contrast with MacFarlane who raised interest rates and spoke out about the property spruikers in Australia is stark.

With regard to derivatives, Commodity Futures Trading Commission (CFTC)wanted impose regulation but again in the late 1990s Greenspan spoke against it (he now admits this was a mistake) and I think the senior bureaucrat pushing for regulation was fired by Bush.

I thought it was a good piece. I have yet to be convinced that governments provide better answers than the market.

As Friedman once said East and West Germany provided one of the few controlled experiments in economics about the effectiveness of socialist planning compared to markets.
Posted by EQ, Friday, 6 February 2009 10:38:03 AM
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Rudd’s main ambitions have always been to appear on the covers of magazines, and to spend more time overseas than he does at home so that he can be seen as a ‘world leader’ as soon possible.

Being Prime Minister of Australia is only a launching pad for his ambition.

Rudd is now showing himself to be more of a Whitlamite than Whitlam. At least Whitlam could, if he wanted to, claim that he had disloyal and devious Ministers who stabbed him in the back. Rudd, a one man band, has no excuse; and his “neo-liberalism” twaddle about a system which gave Australia the best times it has had for many a year, just highlights the silly man’s economic illiteracy. Even Hawk and Keating must be shuddering: they never believed in this crap.

It is now possible to envisage a clandestine visit to the Governor General to try a Kerr on Mr. Rudd.

This is the best article yet on the most dangerous and incompetent Prime Minister we have had since Malcolm Fraser. It should be taken very seriously.
Posted by Leigh, Friday, 6 February 2009 10:44:49 AM
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I don’t know Leigh, I think it is too late; it is a pity that we cannot convert Kevin’s Ego into ability ,then we might just have a chance , but his Ego is just so far above his ability , all the Narcissistic contempt he conjures up in his own mind of everyone , is grim reaperish in stature and execution .
He is off with the pixies – and seminally on his way, Mr Rudd is content on the label of National destroyer- in Socialist circles , it is the equivalent of Victoria Cross ; He has managed to quell the evils of Capitalism , The Socialist Enemy” , and in record time- unchallenged.

Just when you thought it was enough bad news of fiscal and social decimation – But wait - And there is more;
This is only one tier of the Psychopaths Lottery; you still have to live with the legacy of State Labour Government Psychopaths; -
You may now know it is over- and good luck. You will need every single ounce of it.
Posted by All-, Friday, 6 February 2009 12:14:03 PM
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And this is supposed to be what passes for an "intelligent" critique of Kevin Rudd and his ideas and policies. And an assessment of the state of the Australia and the world altogether too.

Anyone who thinks that capitalism, especially as it has been brought to one and all by the deregulating Friedmanite/Hayekian neo-pyschopaths should spend some time reading all of the descriptions of where the world is at, and why, on this site.

http://www.ispeace723.org/toc.html

A quote re the adolescent neo-psychotic nightmare from another essay by the same author:

"When the entire human world founds itself on the adolescent motive to aggrandize the individual ego-"I", then everyone is collectively working toward the destruction not only of human culture and mankind itself, but even of the Earth itself, the very vehicle that supports life. The root of this terrible destructiveness is simply the aggrandizement and idealization of egoity, and the illusion that the consumer ego-"I" is great."

Also:

"Therefore, societies based on competitive individualism, and egoic self-fulfilment, and merely gross or superficial mindedness actually destroy culture, and all, until then, existing cultures, and cultural adaptations."
Posted by Ho Hum, Friday, 6 February 2009 1:17:42 PM
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Those who were so blinded by their loathing of Mr Howard and Mr Costello are now getting what they deserve. Future generations are going to pay for this stupidity.
Posted by runner, Friday, 6 February 2009 4:14:57 PM
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If this came from someone who are not trying to bribe Australian people into voting for him, it might be worth something. The last person who bribe the electorate was Magabe.

Why does Rudd favours a handout, rather than a tax cut, ie one that is the center of Barack Obama's package and the one from the coalition?

Doesn't a one off stimulus only delay unemployment for the short term? Why would you not give tax cuts which reduces unemployment for the long term

That is because Labor want to give us handouts until the next elections, so that they can induce us to vote for them with the handouts. watch for a handout about a week before the next election, coming late this year.

While if they had choosen tax cut, jobs might be creater over the long term, but when Labor goes to the next election, there might be enough unemployed to kicked them out of office

So Rudd choose to spend more of your money to ensure he will be elected at the next election. He is doing what is good for the ALP and not what is good for Australia.

So when you next hear about the economic credential of our esteemed Kevin Rudd .....
Posted by dovif2, Friday, 6 February 2009 4:18:21 PM
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Rudd dragging himself from his reclining comatose intellectual state in short breaths puffs his wrath on the sins of economic liberalism. It is amusing to see what a dilettante he is in economic knowledge and economic history when he writes off with a flourish of his pen the great prosperity that unregulated free markets have brought to the world and whose predecessors from the same political stable, Hawke and Keating, so keenly and ardently embraced.

http://kotzabasis.com
Posted by Themistocles, Friday, 6 February 2009 6:59:05 PM
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Rudd's biography should be titled "the ego has landed".

Completely forgetting that he promised the electorate that the ALP could guide the ship of state with the same steady hand that the coalition did but with a human face, he has now revealed his true colours as a closest socialist and is prepared to throw out the promise of fiscal rectitude and revert to the big spending labor tradition that will paid for by future generations.

Once we have enjoyed the hit of the fiscal stimulus, we will have to deal with the hangover, and call in the coalition to once again deal with the socialist detritus.
Posted by Shadow Minister, Saturday, 7 February 2009 1:57:29 AM
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Wow!
More profligate than Whitlam and crazier than Latham what a combination! Ah Mr.Rudd you have done it again.

I am so heartened by so many people realising how wrong our Prime Minister is but sorry that we will be paying for his incompetence for many many years.

Election the end of this year mmmmmm lovely thought
Posted by JBowyer, Saturday, 7 February 2009 5:20:42 AM
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Why is it so impossible to conceive of 'extremist capitalism' yet in the same breath run away with hysterical fear at those evil government bureaucrats taking over our free will and limiting our freedoms?

Surely both extreme capitalism and communism, are equally undesirable. A system where there is no balance of power, that is, distribution of power between governments (the people) and the private sector sets itself up for failure.

Even, Greenspan admitted he had "put too much faith in the self-correcting power of free markets" to quote the New York Times article below.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/24/business/economy/24panel.html?scp=2&sq=alan%20greenspan&st=cse

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/10/23/AR2008102300193.html

Rudd is a politician - while not averse to a photo opportunity he no more postures than Turnbull - so it is not the posturing that is of concern but which side they hail from it would seem.

Posturing comes with the job and while we might all wish for a low key 'non saviour' style in a leader (thinking of Lindsay Tanner, a Nick Minchin, a Fred Chaney or a Bob Brown) it cannot be guaranteed in politics.

Any politician might appear as a saviour when compared to a Bush or a Howard which will be emphasised by the media and public expectations alike. After a drought even a drop of water is appreciated.
Posted by pelican, Saturday, 7 February 2009 1:51:42 PM
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Rudd was elected on a lie.

Me tooism. He was going to be just like John Howard. That was the only reason Rudd was elected by many who switched sides.

I think it unlikely Rudd will face the polls as PM. The stonewall silence from his Labour colleagues is deafening. Not one has come out in support of Rudd's 'thesis'. Why would they? Any future labour leader will have to repudiate all Rudd has espoused before any elector will believe any labour leader as fiscally conservative or as steady as John Howard. Australians just don't knowingly elect socialist and fiscally irresponsible leaders

Rudd has painted not only himself but the whole labor party as closet socialists ready to attain power in any fashion. He's also tainted them as supporters of wasteful big spending sprees.

Every labour member would be dreading the next election, for they are now seen as supporting big spending and total government control socialist attitudes ... that have never worked anywhere.

The next election will be interesting without Rudd for he won't have wide enough support to survive his now certain 'Ides of March' moment.

Turnbull's stalling of the next 'big spending stimulus' package was astute after Rudd spilt his guts with his socialist cant. He now doesn't have to do much other than point to a wasted $22 billion dollar surplus, mounting state and federal deficits, rising unemployment, rising business interest rates, rising consumer inflation, falling asset values, ineffective state and federal service provision, a failing 'education revolution, silence from Garrett on environmental issues including whaling, Rudd's troop withdrawal in the face of certain victory in Iraq and his involving us further in the unwinnable crap of Afghanistan, reversal of labour laws to 1970's state, reversals over his Emissions Trading scheme ... oh God the list as Jack Johnson says 'goes on and on, and on and on'

And what about his hailing of and kowtowing to his commie heroes in China? What terribly bad judgement that was.

Hugo Rudd is a big fat liar ... without the oil reserves ... and uncorruptable electrol system.
Posted by keith, Saturday, 7 February 2009 5:08:14 PM
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Pelican

Greenspan might be a doubting Thomas about "the self-correcting powers of the market" but paradoxically he still remains a strong believer in them. The last paragraph of the NYT article, Greenspan's quote , tells it all.

It is always intellectually foolhardy to quote one out of context.

http://kotzabasis.com
Posted by Themistocles, Saturday, 7 February 2009 6:25:38 PM
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Could it be that we now have a carefully chosen political activist Governor-General to obviate any possibility of 'The Dismissal' being repeated?
Posted by Bushranger 71, Monday, 9 February 2009 7:28:33 AM
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Another Neo-Liberal apologist with nothing to offer but sniping!
If they had any *real* argument then I expect we would have heard it by now. (Fact is any remnants of a "philosophy" of the Right is in tatters.)
The Neo-Libs have been caught red handed at the scene of the crime this time. They didn't hand-off the economy to Labor quite quickly enough to avoid the blame...but still they try!
How many of these "pump and dump" cycles must we live through before the pattern is seen?
Seems the best they can do is get back on the anti-intellectual bandwagon so beloved of the Right
Posted by Ozandy, Monday, 9 February 2009 8:14:06 AM
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What people have to realize about Kevin Rudd is that essentially he is a decent bloke. He has a guiding philosophy that is fundamentally sound, and goes to church on a Sunday. We have seen plenty of comments harking back to the 70s and 80s, when the very fabric of Australian society was ripped apart by lawyers of both political parties. KR is not a lawyer. For the first time in sixty years we have a man as PM who is not a lawyer.

Big Business which can afford to pay lawyers has been rampaging around Australia for far too long. The accountability that was built into the system, until 1970s, when it was removed by the Liberal Party, is showing signs of being restored. KR through Chris Bowen has amended the Trade Practices Act 1974 to eliminate the unconstitutional word Court, from the Act and substitute the word court. You see KR understands that the Constitution is not simply an Act to be ignored, as most lawyers understand it, but is the fundamental document governing the Commonwealth.

While the words Court and Judge, which do not appear in the Constitution have been allowed by the Liberals to creep into the law, and into Statutes, the criminals who have failed to obey the Constitution and also failed to apply the Trade Practices Act 1974 or allow anyone to take advantage of it, can expect to be deposed.

Labor Government, between 1993 and 1996, introduced all the reforms that would have stopped the global meltdown in Australia. The Liberals through Courts and Judges, prevented them from being applied. The Labor Party introduced the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights but because the Liberals continued Courts and Judges, the one man bands of atheist government have refused to accept Parliamentary authority. The High Court is also unwilling to accept Parliamentary Authority, and the High Court in 2004 should all be indicted. If Judges wont obey the Law, they are unfit to rule. Since 1970 the Commonwealth has been dysfunctional. KR will probably make it work as it is supposed to work.
Posted by Peter the Believer, Monday, 9 February 2009 8:37:17 AM
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The fact that the word Neo is placed in front of any terminology to label is done to antagonise and to give reference to the NAZI, connotation; - The fact of the matter is , that Liberalism is the Useless idiot subscriber , and the ruminant measure socialism uses to further degrade social values and defininitions of that standard .

Forget the Neo Cons or Neo Liberalism- all that would be is a terminology to create an existence of a dissident entity that differs from the Lo-Bo Dec’s – Lobotomized decadent Moron’s , or total Useless Idiots beyond reprieve ;-
It is all Idiots spherical , and it is the only Right and left – Juxtaposed to right and wrong-
Lying and thievery ;- mass misappropriation of public moneys with intent to cripple a Nation is not the definition of Politics ;-
That is an act of War against a sovereign Country.
It use to be called treason once, now it is called Labour politics.
Posted by All-, Monday, 9 February 2009 11:14:36 AM
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Themistocles you said:

"Greenspan might be a doubting Thomas about "the self-correcting powers of the market" but paradoxically he still remains a strong believer in them....It is always intellectually foolhardy to quote one out of context."

I am always willing to link to an article that tells the whole story. My point is not lost. If Greenspan is taking a second look at his faith in the free market perhaps we should all take a second look and question some of the premises from which the anti-regulation groups base their beliefs.

I was not offering Greenspan as a convert. He is too immersed in the laissez-faire dogma to see the basic flaws in a religious-like faith in the market to self-correct or self-regulate.

It is always amusing that the anti-regulation lot depict the Left in a Brothers Grimm fairytalesque style of evil-doing "dangerous thinking" yet are blinkered to the extremes of the equally concerning and radical unfettered market.

What is wrong with some middle ground? It is not altogether unsurprising that the consequences (and blatant excess) of the system under a wholly unregulated market has not generated more pause for thought on this issue.
Posted by pelican, Monday, 9 February 2009 7:28:35 PM
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Splendid essay Greg.Wholly agree with most of your valid points. Kevin's oxymoronic thesis in the " Monthly " is his second faux pas gaffe since insulting his Chinese host, whilst serving with DFAT as a staffer. Even then, this scnook harboured aspirations way beyond his intellect.

The juggernaut trio Bernarke, Paulson and US Treasury have already spent a staggering $ 34 B to revive the economy. The $ 7.2 trillion bail-out is leaking like a sieve with most recipients baying for more. Obama's $ 77.5 T stimulus will not staunch the harmorrhage which is on the brink of bankruptcy. It's unlikely the US Treasury will have enough printed money. Ironically, Moody's and S & P's AAA credit rating is being revised in light of the latest unemployment figures, burgeoning deficit and worthless Treasury script, nobody wants to buy. The US economy is in a tight spin. Bill Gates predicts the recession might hopefully emerge 2012. He's tipping eight million will lose their jobs; 70 % will default on their homes. Social security going bazonkas. Imploding. In a nut shell, misery and total dependence on taxpayer's purse strings, exacerbating ten fold. The second Obama stimulus will only scratch the surface. It's developed into a cess pool with no bottom is sight. Ultimately, there just wont be enough green-backs to shore up the growing deficit.

What happend to the American Dream ?

Well, 2009 has already been written off as a loss. Politicians are running the Govt,and the behemoth Bureaucrats are running the Fed Reserve. Bush and Co, rewarding the greedy risk takers who made brainless decisions, willingly choose excessive debt to climb the social ladder. Alas, the calvary..oops the American taxpayer is a'coming to the rescue. They simply haven't arrived at a solution. They are rewarding the wrong people. They have lost sight of the fundamentals.

Schizoid Kevin, sheets the blame for the Global crisis on neo-liberal Western Economies over a 30 year time span. Same old theories FDR,Keynes and the Marshall Plan. Quote: "..social democratic Govt must raise to the further challenge of developing a practical policy response to..
Posted by jacinta, Monday, 9 February 2009 7:32:08 PM
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the crisis etc." His espoused doctrine is a regurgiated facsimile of stalwarts Whitlam, Hawke and Keating. Zilch for originality Kev. His jaundiced outlook dosen't take into acount a $ 20 B surplus from JH / Costello, and the fact Peter took a decade to redeem $ 100 B deficit Labor's trio saddled Aust with.

Rudd's December defacto $10.4 B stimulus to soothe the chutzpah pensioners and welfare mums didn't go far enough. It didn't revive the Retail Industry, instead it was squandered on the gaming and alcohol beverage Industry.His other ponzi schemes to bolster the Auto, Building and Banking etc bebefited ACTU unionist and Corporate Flyers who created this unholy mess, with dubious loans, hedging, short selling, and lack of transparancy ! It didn't solve unemployment, company earnings, ASX shares, bankruptcies, loss of confidence etc.

Glen Steven's RBA's CEO, was urging Aust to spend, spend and get yourself into hock, to save the Nation ! What does it say about Aust top bureacrat ? The sheer irresponsibility of an Economic guru, tasked with the Nations wealth. His much acclaimed independence has been compromised and he should walk the walk. He was mouthing exactly the Swan spiel. For months Swan was tipping interest rates falling, bewailing the RBA and 4 Pillar Banks for not passing int rates to customers. The Banks grudgingly obliged only after Rudd imprudently extended a blanket guarantee backed by the RBA. His rhetoric labels him an amateurish economic charlatan, with minimal street cred.

No one except the Banks knew the full extent of their bad debts and shonky deals including the Madoff scam and fall-out. They are still in limbo because none have been audited by reputable independent third party Auditors. It' happening in the US, UK and leading OECD Nations.

The RBA announces Annual growth, inflation, employemnt figures etc. These announcements have been revised 15 times, with rates plummeting. RBA's lack of foresight, economic nous, and the falling Oz dollar, plus the choice of bed-partners, does not bode well.Generation X,Y and Z notwithstanding. RBA's street-cred is in tatters.
Posted by jacinta, Monday, 9 February 2009 8:33:20 PM
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Jacinta

Interest rate cuts are a load of crap.

Every small business person knows their interest rates are rising ... if they can refinance.

Cutting home loan rates while sticking up business loan rates will do a number of things ... create small business closures, lower employment and cause mortgage defaults. So much for our solid banks. They with their opportunistic gouging along with Hugo Rudd's handouts are making things much much worse for us all in the long run. Most of the billions in Rudd's throwaway splurges, have no doubt, will mostly end up in the banks, who are hoarding cash in fear of a further international credit crisis.
Hugo Rudd's cash throwaways allow consumers to reduce bank mortgages, bank credit card debt, and other bank debt. Any extra money spent in retail will be used by business to reduce bank debt or meet bank margin calls.

Why are the idiots so bloody stupidly short-sighted?
Posted by keith, Tuesday, 10 February 2009 8:53:53 AM
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