Thanks, Peter, for yet another thought provoking article. While your discourse focuses upon the message to be proclaimed by the preacher, the missing elements are the attitudes and behaviour of the preacher in their interactions with members of their flock. Too often today preachers fail to recognise they are talking to intelligent, and mostly, fairly well educated people. People who can generally spot a hypocrite fairly quickly.

Therefore, for a preacher to be effective today those listening need to see in his/her demeanour some evidence that they take the gospel message they are proclaiming seriously, to the point of adopting a servant leadership model and demonstrating at least some modesty and humility. Pomposity and overt hypocrisy are big turnoffs to people today, especially the young, no matter how sound the message might be.

Excellent article Peter. I will say though I believe many young people today are responding to the reality of the power of the gospel message. The liberals seem to have only the old traditionals hanging on as well as the lefties in the media and the flakes seem to have the gullible. I am encouraged by the number of young people sold out to the gospel of Christ. I know one girl who topped her year 12 in her town and yet still decided to take the gospel to China. There are still many paying the price to take the gospel out. God has used her in an amazing way. I recently spent some time with a group of young people who simply desire the reality of the life changing message of Jesus. The best preachers are those who know that they have a great responsibility in giving out the only message that can change and challenge hearts and save souls.

I felt the article related mainly to the traditional churches who seem to have lost what they were Given.

Im connected the charismatics and I find our preaching is still on-fire for Jesus and we still make congregationalists aware of satan and his spirits...quite a lot actually.
Our three churches, the three the family goes to, are mostly non-political and that helps.
We didnt get distracted:)
We see miracle healings and we hear prophetic words from The Holy Spirit.
Christ is preached in every meeting and theres always an alter call for people to give their lives to The Lord. The churches we go to are full of joy and we really dance around in praise and worship.

Sadly, I dont see much hope for the "trads" unless they are going to open up to The Holy Spirit and invite Him to take charge of their churches.

When someone can prove to me that God exits, I will then listen to any preacher, either Traditionalist or Modern, what a delusion preachers convey to the gullible.

There is one other failure of nerve that you have not quite touched upon. That is the failure which comes from those who do see life is fraught with difficulty, but who retreat to old models of preaching. So they preach about the dangers and shortcomings of life in the language of those C16 preachers you mention. Social justice that relates to C21, social comment beyond safe antiabortion statements and anti drink statements etc, does not happen. So the preaching sounds relevant and not full of platitudes, indeed it is often strident and andgry, but it is still afraid.

Preachers are too often scared to criticise the immigration detention centres or the racism in our own congregations etc. I can't blame us, I might add. When I commented, a couple of years ago, that if Jesus family had fled to Australia and not Egypt they would have been put into Woomera, I was heckled from the pews, three people pointedly walked out and I was physically intimidated by another after church.

Andrew Prior http://www.churchrewired.org

Ojnab, Expecting someone to prove that God exists is as inane as someone expecting you to prove that S/He doesn't. The existence or non-existence of God is a 'mystery' to mankind, which makes it all that more interesting and exciting in this world where so many people demand proof prior to being able to believe in a phenomenonal view of the world and our place in it. A mystical framework of understanding that has stood the test of time, for 2000 to 5000 years now, despite the attempts of men and women to bring it down, is something I give thanks for having been given.

Ojnab... it doesn't work that way.

It is preaching first.. then belief, then fellowship/baptism/growth to maturity.

The preaching should be connected to the contemporary situation I agree....but it must inevitably end at this point:

God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and power, and how he went around doing good and healing all who were under the power of the devil, because God was with him.

"We are witnesses of everything he did in the country of the Jews and in Jerusalem. They killed him by hanging him on a tree, but God raised him from the dead on the third day and caused him to be seen. He was not seen by all the people, but by witnesses whom God had already chosen—by us who ate and drank with him after he rose from the dead. He commanded us to preach to the people and to testify that he is the one whom God appointed as judge of the living and the dead.

All the prophets testify about him that everyone who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name."

COMMENT
The above was Peters message to a Gentile family of a man named Cornelius who's heart God had prepared.That my dear Oj is the goal of preaching. To invoke repentance in the human heart, and faith in Christ Jesus for forgiveness of sin and newness of life.
That can be your experience, and the same goes for every OLO poster.

Preaching points to a man, an event... a reason, and a resurrection.

Jesus' main criticisms were directed at the elite in society - including priests. He had no time for money lenders (don't hear priests discussing the current banking problems), lawyers, and temple leaders - the very structure which keeps the ordinary man in his oppressed place.

It is usually accepted that a positive should be capable of being supported by evidence whereas it is not possible to prove a negative. I would be reasonably satisfied if someone could show a physical location where God could exist. I am with Terry Lane who once commented, "Where does God exist other than in a believer's head?"
If that is the case where does God go in an Alzheimer victim?

I'm a Gen Y Christian who has spent much of my Christian life in the Charismatic churches. I thank GOD for so many of the good things that have come out of them, but I am weary of some tendencies some churches have fallen into over the years- namely the prosperity/health and wealth Gospel.

Also, the tendency to imply that Salvation from our sins and death is not enough, and so we have to sweeten the deal by promising people "total victory" and "abundance" in this life, rather than teaching people to seek first the Kingdom of GOD, and realise the whole point of man is to fear GOD and obey all of his commands (according to Ecclesiastes), or to glorify GOD and enjoy Him forever (as some theologians have put it).

Another tendency I see, especially off the backs of a lot of American preachers, is the idea to promote Christian humanism- you are the total focus of everything and the solution to all of the world's problems- but Jesus wants to be your best friend too. That's a nice idea, but it's not what the early church literally gave their lives to preach, and it's not the Gospel.

The Bible speaks so much about the world hating our message ("if they hate you, remember they hated Me first"- Jesus). "Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil." "The Gospel is foolishness to those who are perishing but to those who are being saved it is the power of GOD to eternal life."
Even in the church, Paul tells Timothy to "Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction. For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths."

As Paul says, "I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God for the salvation of everyone who believes...For in the gospel a righteousness from God is revealed, a righteousness that is by faith from first to last, just as it is written: "The righteous will live by faith."

The Gospel will not be popular to mankind because it convicts us of sin. The Word of GOD "penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. Nothing in all creation is hidden from God's sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account."

We can preach our own message and it will be suitably weak. But the power of GOD resides in the Gospel itself that promises righteousness, right standing with GOD and eternal life (Jn 3:16) and it is this Gospel we are called to preach, not that of our own choosing.

People have asked me what they should do to reach out to Gen Y from within the Church. This is my answer: Preach the Gospel. The method, etc. is secondary to this- it really doesn't matter- ultimately it is GOD's love and kindness that draws people to Him at the preaching of the Word anyway. Just do what Jesus told you and preach and live THE Gospel. As with other generations, some will be convicted and turn to Christ. Others will be offended and turn away. But your job is to preach the Gospel.

Peter, I'm curious, do you not believe in eternal life/eternal damnation? What do you believe happens after physical death, and what is your Biblical basis for your beliefs?

Dear Netjunkie..... they were beautiful posts ... addressing the 'properity' side of things.. a hearty amen brother...

We must one of these days organize a 'skype' conference :) or live discussion between some of us... all free.. great stuff.

Gee even Pericles, Bugsy, CJ and various others could join in on that :)

Speaking of which... (Skype Conference) have you considered the possibilities for evangelism that such a means represents?

Technology these days can multiply our presense to far and wide.

It would be quite possible to have an online Church with people in any country who are encouraged by Bible study from far way, and where the Authorities who might not be sympathetic to the Gospel cannot interfere.

netjunkie

You show wisdom beyond your years. You are spot on with the excesses in the me/prosperity stuff. The power is in the gospel. It is foolishness to those who are perishing but has the power to save and set free. I am sure that many who grew up in pentecostal/charismatic churches feel similar to you. Don't however discount that genuine miracles still happen today. There is a lot of flakey rubbish but Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever. God bless you richly. We need more like you who will only settle for the reality of Christ and not some subsitute. Learning to be content in whatever circumstances is the real key to prosperity. If we have food and clothing we should be content. If we have more than we need to be generous with it. If their is no eternal life/damnation the gospel makes no sense and Jesus is found to be a liar. A gospel without these truths is no genuine gospel.

Foyle you are so right in your comments, all preachers preach about in any church or other place of worship is about the so called love etc of this unseen God and son, they never ever preach about the rape, incest, killing people, whether it be young or old, wars etc, yes! the Bible is a very violent book, it also was written be men so we are told who believed the world was flat, still if all you gullible people believe such rubbish I am very happy for you, when we die we will be the same as before we came, ie, knowing nothing of our being here, so will not miss anything.
Also there are quite a few hundred religions in the world. where do they fit into the one and only supposedly correct Christian religion, they are just as correct as any other delusional religion

Happiness is the now-and-forever Mystery that IS the Real Heart and the Only Real God of every one.

1. http://www.dabase.org/oltawwfh.htm

2. http://www.realgod.org

One wonders whether Sells is living in 2008 or 1908 or perhaps even 1808. His essay could very well have been written at either of those times.

And what about the overwhelming majority of the worlds people who are not "christian", or dont believe in the other childhood fairy stories that are part and parcel of the "jesus" meme---the tooth fairy, santa claus and the easter wabbit.

Children very quickly learn that these other three are not true--so why not, if you are in any sense rational, see through "sweet baby jesus" too? And throw it all away.

The Process that is True Religion begins with radical (meaning at the root) investigation of the nature of ones personal identity---what am I as a conscious being, even while asleep.

And what is my relationship to every thing and every one, or the entirety of manifest "creation" with all of its space-time pardoxes.
Again even while asleep.

Why asleep?

Who or what are "you" in the formless state of deep dreamless sleep?
Understanding who or what the "you" that is still somehow present while in the state of dreamless sleep is the key to understanding who or what "you" are altogether---before "you" fall into fearful identification with the mortal meat-body when you "wake-up"!!

Once having identified with the solidly defined meat-body personality (persona = false face) you have to invent a "creator"-god idea to justify and account for this "fall", and to help keep it all in "order" and to punish the trangressors or "sinners".

Meat-body personalities always create dis-orders of ever increasing magnitude.

And no amount of righteous sermonising, and appeals to the ancient TRIBAL CULTIC (genocidal) deity, is going to make the slightest bit of difference in 2008.

netjunkie

It is obvious that the kingdom of Heaven/God that Jesus announced is an earthly reality that has the potential to return us to paradise, that is, the state legendarily of the garden of Eden. That is what Jesus meant when he turned to the repentant thief on the cross. It is also true that in the biblical imaginary there is no life outside of the body. That is why the resurrection is portrayed as the resurrection of a body and not of the presence of a spirit and also why Jesus bodily ascends to the Father. Of course this all produces problems with how we understand the nature of the world. What does it mean that Jesus sits bodily at the right hand of the Father? How does Jesus appear to the disciples in the closed room and then disappear if he is a body? The tensions in the text indicate that we are dealing here with theological legend but we are nevertheless to proclaim that Christ is risen and ascended, that is the centre of faith.

The other tack that is taken on this comes from the history of tradition. Israel had no place for life after death unless it was a dreary life of shades similar to that described in Greek legend. Israel looked for salvation of the self and the nation in this life, not one after death. This was modified under persecution in the intertestimental period when justice for suffering was seen as something in the future. However no idea of life after death was developed. See Maccabeus for this.

The idea of life after death came originally from Zoroastrians and such an infectious idea spread to Christianity and in the Middle ages became the principal focus. I think that this is a distortion of the gospel. Death is real death, real extinction, the loss of the self. This is not the end of the story because the church celebrates the communion of saints. Here we encounter yet more theological problems. What does it mean to say that death has lost its sting?

Peter Sellick

Hmmm ... maybe we could sit in silence and listen for the still small voice, like Buddhists or Quakers. However I do like a good sermon if it's explaining something interesting - the last one I heard like that was from a rabbi in the synagogue explaining that God made the Jewish dietary laws as a half way house to us eventually becoming vegetarians.