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The Forum > Article Comments > An audit for educational disadvantage > Comments

An audit for educational disadvantage : Comments

By Valerie Yule, published 15/8/2008

Community action that is needed for Julia Gillard's vision.

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Thanks for your sensible article!

Its term 3 and time for schools and teaching agencies to dig the bottom of the barrel in the search for emergency teachers to cover classes. Its quite obvious that the Victorian high schools built in the late 1970s around a series of courtyards have pleasant playgrounds where the year 7 girls can practice disco dancing at lunch time while the year 11 boys hide in an opposite courtyard playing cards. The teachers expect and get good behaviour and have silence when explaining new material.

Now schools are built for 3000+ pupils, in one school all of the school yard can be surveyed from the staff room, even the lockers are in narrow shelters wide enough for 2 rows of lockers only. Kids roam the oval at lunchtime in packs of 600. Boys kick 2 litre water bottles instead of footballs. In class the teachers struggle for pupils attention and rarely explain work in silence and "work refusers" abound. To top it off the child centred curriculum has only 3 2 hour periods a day with studnets remaining in the same classroom with teachers moving around. What about letting off steam? Imagine learning maths in year 7 in 2 hour blocks! It could be that the kids of nappy valley are always more rambunctious than the kids of established suburbs.

The emergency teachers often face recalcitrant classes who haven't had a permanent teacher all year, you wonder about the salary savings that the principal is making to earn his bonus. Most emergency teachers want a permanent job, they want to earn $47,000 per year rather than a max of $660 for 5 days work. The school is entitled to ask emergency teachers to do morning recess and lunchtime yard duty but this is a dangereous practice when the whisper is that a big fight is planned for Friday lunchtime. Making the teachers wear flouro vests and id tags isn't the answer - the kids are the biggest danger.
Posted by billie, Friday, 15 August 2008 10:19:39 AM
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It is a catch 22 situation.
Unless society in the school catchment enhances the environment from which students are sourced, the schools are disadvantaged. Unless the schools are able to advance the students in a combination of education, culture, and self-discipline the society is at a disadvantage.

Society is in a downward spiral when educational opportunity exists as a form of apartheid. Where public funds are diverted to educational establishments cherry-picking students from those perceived to be gifted. Where those deemed non-gifted may be assessed as such wholly due to hearing problems, eye disorders, dysfunctional home environments, etc..
As exemplified in 1968-69 by Education Minister Malcolm Fraser’s defence of 50 per cent public funding for a (second) swimming pool to one of his old schools while less-affluent schools languished. He initially defended the payment upon encouragement for parents to participate financially in their childrens’ schools. His final defence of such Government munificence was by stating that “someone had to be hewers of wood and drawers of water”. Obviously on the basis of parential affluence in that instance.

I salute the author in drawing attention to the needs behind an education system which will genuinely advance the totality of students and their environments; thereby benefiting the national interest rather than causing further division within it.
Posted by colinsett, Saturday, 16 August 2008 1:45:02 PM
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?Community effort is needed for Julia Gillards "vision"?

Julia Gillards educational "Vision" looks very similar to Liberal Party Policy which she previously rejected. The Labour Party is great at "Visions", yet do little about putting them into practice. The Labour Party will again be frozen by its allegiance to Unions, fear of alienating voters and inherent inability to do anything other than "talk big". Unfortunately, nothing can change until someone has the guts to make the big decisions and enforce them. Its up to Government so please don't keep loading the burden on that vague entity called "the Community". That's the perfect way to get nothing done. Doesn't Julia know what to do?

Enough "Visions" - Go and do it, Julia.
Posted by Atman, Saturday, 16 August 2008 9:23:38 PM
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The following approach was recommended in 1990 by Marilyn Jager Adams in her book, Beginning to Read.
Unfortunately, no one ever checked it out, so she has apparently given up in disgust.

Bob
May 25, 2008
Maria Montessori wrote, almost a century ago, that three- and four-year-old preschoolers will learn to read spontaneously if they get "sufficient" practice forming alphabet letters. Although boldly claimed in her "The Montessori Method" this possibility has strangely never before been subjected to a scientific test.
Posted by rovarose, Sunday, 17 August 2008 2:15:52 AM
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Dear Atman, re ‘It’s up to Government so please don't keep loading the burden on that vague entity called "the Community". That's the perfect way to get nothing done. Doesn't Julia know what to do?’

Yes, certainly the government has a great deal to do, pointed out in previous articles, but please read this article carefully and see how much else is NOT government business, and DOES need community. ‘Less Stalk Strine’ points out how an Oz attitude is ‘aorta’ and it’s usually the government that orta.
Also in the firing line is how children are being brought up disadvantaged, with or without money, and unnecessary barriers to education in classrooms themselves.

RE Rovarose’s query about Montessori. It does help children to copy letters, or play with colored plastic alphabet letters, copying and making up words. Yes, there has been research showing it helps – but it’s a bit of a bother for adults packing up the letters afterwards, who have not shown the children how to do it. And it is not the only thing needed. See one way of doing this at http://www.ozreadandspell.com.au/playtoread.htm
Posted by ozideas, Sunday, 17 August 2008 5:12:42 PM
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An interesting collection of ideas, mostly hitting the mark – with some interesting angles.

Such as her opening appeal to private school parents: i.e. they need to add the downstream social costs to the amounts they pay in school fees – neat.

She wants “Disadvantaged parents and their children need to be convinced of the value of being educated” They sure do. Unfortunately we herd disadvantaged families into places and schools with similar others….and the mechanism of school choice makes sure that there is no one left in such schools to convince the disadvantage of the value of education.

The idea of twinning “privileged private schools” with poor schools? This ‘noblesse oblige’ culture was quite in vogue before we had such messy things as public education, inclusive schools…. and democracy.

Maybe Valerie should have stuck to resident caretakers and Dragon classes.
Posted by bunyip, Monday, 18 August 2008 8:37:00 AM
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While governments are involved in education the results will always be much less than ideal. We continually hear stories of children going through the system without an appropriate level of reading or mathematics.
Government funding of education should only be on a "per student" basis. Then let the market get fully involved as it was over a hundred years ago.
When we are deciding where to best invest our money for the future we don't let the government interfere so why let them meddle in our children's future through a restrictive education system?
Posted by RobertG, Monday, 18 August 2008 12:57:45 PM
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Ozideas, You have misinterpreted my call for Government action as excessive reliance on Government. Nothing could be further from the truth. Rudd and Co have become expert at "motherhood statements" yet do little. So,they immediately pass the responsibility for action back to the "Community"!

The vague call to the imaginary entity called Community is a way of avoiding the responsibilities of Government and then complaining no-one cares and thats why nothing was achieved.

The Government must LEGISLATE and LEAD for goodness sakes.

Its nice to know Julia wants to help. Now Julia, go and DO something.
Posted by Atman, Friday, 22 August 2008 4:24:40 PM
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The article was filled with feel good platitudes that failed to address the relevant aspects of the causes of disadvantaged schools. Many people remain in their gilded cages, failing to understand the nature of those "on the other side" yet filled with good ideas of "how to solve the problem".
Marie Antoinette said "Let them eat cake" in response to poverty... and this article is written in the same vein.
"And let families and communities themselves try to prevent their children starting school already educationally disadvantaged." Children starting school educationally disadvantaged come from families who are educationally disadvantaged.They are so often underresourced and unable to prevent their families starting school educationally disadvantaged. We need to recognise where these impoverished communities reside and begin helping those within the communities to overcome their socioeconomic disadvantage, and learn the skills to enable their chldren to overcome the apparent disadvantage. We need to begin these approaches well before children reach school age, because by seven years old, a child's brain is almost fully formed.
It takes a village to raise a child, and in this case we need to have commiment and resourcing to reach into villages to raise children.
By the way, one has to look at the mindset that are cynical about providing the impoverished with laptops. In our computer driven society, laptops only begin to address disparities, and indeed we need free laptops and more, so very much more.

Here is a shopping list. How much will be bought in the coming financial year?

It is easy to throw suggestions at people...become sargeant major teachers... create orderly classrooms... be
Posted by Sofisu, Tuesday, 26 August 2008 8:41:01 PM
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