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The Forum > Article Comments > It's the end of the world (as we know it) > Comments

It's the end of the world (as we know it) : Comments

By Richard Castles, published 11/8/2008

Gods, myths, climate change and culture. Is uncertainty the only certainty, and change unchangeable?

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We are living in a great civilisation that has been based on fossil fuels and taming the world around us. Arguably the peak of American (USA) civilisation was 1970 and since then the majority of americans have funded their declining standard of living on credit. Arguably we passed peak oil around 2000. We have exploited the earth, cutting down its forests and we can see the increasing size of the Shahara desert, the deforestation of the Amazon and the increasing salt levels in australian agricultural lands bought into production since the 1930s.

Any student of history will tell you that civilisations fall when they outgrow their food and fuel supply and their ability to transport food and water for their populations.

So yes it is the end of the world as we know it. Is the new world going to be a "user pays" "dog eat dog" affair or are we going to have a socialised approach to everyone sharing the remaining resources. I think a collective approach to solving this problem will suit me better than me becoming a survivalist farmer in an inaccessible off grid NSW coastal valley.
Posted by billie, Monday, 11 August 2008 12:50:45 PM
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Obviously there is a deep psychological need for many people to envisage the world coming to an end in their time: and this explains many apocalyptic cults -- including early Christianity -- as well as the occasional stock market crash. But why? here are my conclusions:

1. Most of us feel small and worthless most of the time -- we have very little power to influence global affairs. Imminent disaster puts everyone else in the same boat: we take comfort from the belief that the great ones of this earth have just as little power and control over their future as we do.

2. It feels much better to be on the same side as everyone else; spreading apocalyptic hysteria is a great way to build up a close band of caring associates to provide you with emotional support.

What's the solution? Emotional maturity and a sense of perspective. As Mark Twain said: "I have been through terrible things in my life, some of which actually happened."
Posted by Jon J, Monday, 11 August 2008 2:20:43 PM
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All that this essay does is draw together a series of ideas and opinions to "prove" a pre-existing presumption/assumption.

Readers of this forum are probably tired of my pointing to references by this author, but here I go again.
Please check out this reference which gives a completely different assessment of the state of Earth-kind altogether.

http://www.ispeace723.org/youthepeople4.html

The author points to a phrase from the Upanishads: Where there is an other---fear spontaneously arises.

He also poimts out that the moment you presume anything at all to be "other" you immediately seek to control or are at war with the "other", and eventually destroy the "other".

Western "culture" (in particular) is built on the presumption that we are always separate from the Divine, the World Process, and all sentients beings. Which means that we are always at war with the Divine, the world altogether, and all seemingly "other" sentient beings.

He also points out that this over 3000 years long hell-deep cultural script is NOW in its inevitable terminal phase.

Plus if anyone thinks that that recent Barnum & Bailey circus event in Sydney was the sign of a "renewal of culture", as the OZ would have us believe. Or even of the "vitality" of Christianity, then they have not done their homework.

I remember a line from Jefferson Airplane "the human name doesnt mean s--t to a tree" ---particularly a 2000 year old Redwood.

ALL of which Reagan & Co, and the "conservative" mind-set that informs such "conservatism" would have chopped down.
Posted by Ho Hum, Monday, 11 August 2008 2:24:15 PM
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Speaking of Redwood trees, and what they have to teach us.
And even pigs for that matter, please check out this reference.

http://www.fearnomorezoo.org/trees/learn_tree.php
Posted by Ho Hum, Monday, 11 August 2008 2:33:20 PM
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Really fine piece of exposition. I tend to agree with the author that we mythologise 'the end'. I can hear The Doors playing in the background as I write.

I'm not saying that at some time or other giant squid and jellyfish won't arise out of our spa-like oceans and eat us, but I figure we'll be long gone.

I don't subscribe to the end of the world narrative. I do believe that the media has certainly jumped on 'the end of the earth scenario' (which is not what scientists are saying) and there's no one like A Current Affair to do justice (and even anticipating) the end of you and me.

I very much liked the author's sense of humour, which has been so lacking in many climate articles (pro and con) in this forum.
Posted by Cheryl, Monday, 11 August 2008 3:07:37 PM
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Well written and, in my view, true.
Whilst I do not deny climate change, I have long held the view that to blame human activity for it to the exclusion of all else is simply another example of humankind arrogance. Two hundred years or so since the industrial revolution is nothing compared to the earthly timespan.
As I have said elsewhere in this forum, if we want to foul up our own tiny slice of biosphere with atmospheric pollution, fouled waterways, piles of poisonous industrial waste etc., that is our problem. The earth simply doesn't care.
Posted by GYM-FISH, Monday, 11 August 2008 3:53:56 PM
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Richard Castles: "This essay is not about the science of climatology. It is about the mythology of global warming."

That's like saying, "I'm not saying your wrong, but you are wrong, now let's discuss why."

"It comes as no surprise that two psychiatrists recently reported" ... "the delusion that because of climate change, drinking water could lead to the death of millions of people within days."

This is a sad case, but its even sadder (but not that surprising) to see the mental illness of a person being abused by the deniers crowd for shameful political point scoring.

I think perhaps readers should look to the voluminous studies of people that construct elaborate conspiracy theories to try to support their beliefs - people like the members of the Flat Earth Society:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth_Society

There are many similarities with many of the climate change deniers.
Posted by Sams, Monday, 11 August 2008 4:15:58 PM
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I’ve never been much into symbolism or myth; perhaps one of the many parts of the “normal socialisation process” which I missed out on. So I don’t require “sustaining myths in times of change and fear”; and of course “we are part of nature.”

Re the accelerating pace of change, let’s look not at history but at “nature,” reality. The sub-atomic particles of which we and all other material forms are composed arise and pass away at 10pwr22 times per second according to Luis Alvarez, after 20 years observation with his “bubble chamber”, “trillions upon trillions of times” in the blink of an eye according to the Buddha after deep introspection. [At the time of translation, a trillion was 10pwr18.] As far as we know, this pace of change has been the same throughout the earth’s 4.5 billion years.

The problem is that we see ourselves as solid, continuing entities rather than insubstantial bundles of particles which continuously arise and pass away. There is no substance, no permanence, nothing to cling to, no ongoing “I” in the conditioned world [where cause and effect applies, each new particle arising because of prior conditions; nothing too “mysterious” about that]. When this is understood, there can be no fear of change, and we can develop JonJ’s emotional maturity and sense of perspective.

Tea break. Which reminds me of an incident in a book based on war games simulating a German invasion of England in 1940. In a forward observation post after the Germans have landed, Kent is being shelled and bombed and more invaders are arriving, the sergeant attracts his officer’s attention. “You can go now,” says the lieutenant. “No, sir, but with things getting unsettled, this might be the last opportunity to make a pot of tea.”

This captures the British essence – in times of great danger, don’t react rashly; calmly, have a cup of tea, creating a space before taking more considered and less emotional action.

Faced with alleged AGW calamities, please join me in a nice cuppa. (Tim-Tams optional.)
Posted by Faustino, Monday, 11 August 2008 5:25:07 PM
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Well-written, enjoyable to read, and pushing that same friggin' barrow.
Posted by bennie, Monday, 11 August 2008 6:58:33 PM
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We are, I believe fortunate to be living in these times.

Sure things have changed.

I started my working career with the firm knowledge that things would change, not necessarily in ways I could have predicted but certainly in a revolutionary manner which has affected each and every one of us.

And the real point is, they will continue to change and as they do other people, children now, will adapt, as the nature of man is to both adapt to change and change his surroundings to suit those changes.

Some apocalyptic disaster might arrive and wipe out 99.9% of the human population but the world will keep on going. Mankind will, in some form or other survive.

I worry about the things I can influence and change.
I worry about the stupidity of governments who, with arrogance, think they can effect global warming.

I do not worry about the consequences of global warming because those consequences are neither reliably defined nor probable, because the real reason for any supposed global warming has not been adequately determined and its impact remains neither quantified or qualified.

Just a bunch of egos running around proclaiming a dogma in search of government funding.

Either way, the earth has endured ice ages and hot ages and temperate times between. It will continue to be a system in support of life until the sun finally implodes and ceases to radiate its benevolent light upon us.

Then all will cease. I do not predict that to be anytime soon (but I could be wrong).
Posted by Col Rouge, Monday, 11 August 2008 8:56:01 PM
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Beautifully put Jon J. I know that I feel pretty small and uninfluential most of the time, but I suspect even those you refer to as the great ones of the earth have their moments.

Cheryl, GYM-FISH, thank you for your comments.

Faustino, nice food for thought. Alas, I think more than can be adequately discussed here. Perhaps better over a cup of tea. But yes, emotional maturity; cool head, warm heart. And I hope that when the end is near, I'm with someone who has that British sense of humour
Posted by Richard Castles, Monday, 11 August 2008 9:25:00 PM
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Thanks too, bennie, I think. I guess 2 out of 3 ain't bad. I'll try to find a new barrow.
Posted by Richard Castles, Tuesday, 12 August 2008 5:06:24 PM
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Ah, but what about the precautionary principle? If we really believed in that, we would all construct deep underground shelters to protect us against the one-in-65 million year asteroid strikes - you know, the one that put paid to the dinosaurs.

We're about due for another one soon, so get digging!!
Posted by Froggie, Friday, 15 August 2008 9:41:56 PM
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