RHian
Jesus does not condemn those practicing homosexuality specifically. The Apostle Paul does but no more than those committing adultery, fornication, lying or any other sin. To deny the seriousness of sexual sin is to deny the Scriptures and to cheapen the price Christ paid for us to be forgiven for these things. To include mental illness along with those who have given in to gambling, drunkeness etc is a little unfair. One is a choice while the other isn't.

Jesus did consort with prostitutes and tax collectors etc so that He could offer them love and forgiveness not to condone their behaviour. He did not say to the prostitute to continue in sin.

I am just as appalled as most when people practicing homosexuality are singled out to be mocked or have violence done to them. It is however often carried out among themselves due to extremely high rates of promiscurity. Even the GayBC acknowledges this fact http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/content/2007/s1937854.htm

To allow social engineers to teach our children that homosexuality is normal is untruthful and damaging to society. These people need to repent just like anyone else living a sinful life. Thankfully God's grace extends to all who are prepared to accept Christ and turn from their wicked ways.

Paul,

Whilst this is getting a little off-topic, I suggest you take a closer look. The global warming of the 20th-21st century is more significant than the medieval warm period or the little ice age.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:2000_Year_Temperature_Comparison.png

Further, I believe you are incorrect concerning an alleged lack of temperature rises over the past 7-8 years. I urge you to look at the following.

http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/2007/

The earth is warming, it is warming very significantly, it is continuing to get hotter and the scientific consensus is that it is attibutable to human activies. I wish that none of these things were true, but they seem to be, my personal desires notwithstanding.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_opinion_on_climate_change

Runner,

You may continue to make yourself look like a wilfully bigoted and ignorant fundamentalist, as you have done so numerous times in the past and will probably continue to do so in the future.

You may ask yourself however if homosexuality is so unnatural why did God create so many animals that practise it (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_animals)? Perhaps you are, once again, wrong - but also once again lack the cognitive ability to admit it.

One of these days you may decide to improve yourself and realise that not everything in holy book is the literal or complete truth.

Rhian,

Your sort of Christian would be welcome anytime at the church I attend. Thank you for those compassionate and intelligent statements that recognise that 'holy books' provide insight and recognition of the development of the human spirit, the ethical systems we devise and the failings and limits of anything written by the human hand.

Clearly the time has arrived for the Shepherd to reach out his hooked stick thing and BRING BACK a few of us to the tooooopiK. How did this morph into 'Global Warming/Gay rights'?

RELIGIOUS VILIFICATION is the topic people.. *pinch*

CJ.. there are those of us who dream.. and those of us who 'dream and do' :) and then...there are those of us who simply whine about those who 'do'.... I'll leave you to classify urself there 0_^

RHIAN.... you said both admirable things and some not so. Your willingness to have your faith mocked and challenged in forums like this is the admirable bit. (I share that view) But then.... leaping into the "Jesus did not condemn homosexuality" was quite a leap ..but into the dark I'm afraid. Jesus condemned a number of specific behaviors, but He 'generally' condemned 'Immorality' and declared that the immoral will not enter the kingdom of God. He also said "I came to fulfill the law" and "Not one jot or tittle will be changed" (of the law).. words to that effect...and the "Law" of which he spoke clearly and specifically condemns homosexual behavior. (Paul specifically mentions it also)..now.. I won't 'mock' your faith.. which would be innapropriate, but I certainly challenge your view based on the totality of scripture.

LEV.. to be consistent .. "Rhian your kind of Christian is welcome" etc.. you would need to be willing to ALSO accept and embrace members of Nambla who happen to come a knocking on your church door. If you accept that homosexual behavior is ok, then why not those who enjoy such homosexual fun with little boys? If 'adult/child' heterosexual sex is ok to 1.4billion people....why not 'adult/child' homosexual sex?

You leave yourself open to either charges of inconsistent hypocrisy or open slather acceptance of all.

Not only delusional, but back to his good old hateful self - which I supppose is appropriate to a thread about vilification.

<< you would need to be willing to ALSO accept and embrace members of Nambla who happen to come a knocking on your church door. If you accept that homosexual behavior is ok, then why not those who enjoy such homosexual fun with little boys? If 'adult/child' heterosexual sex is ok to 1.4billion people....why not 'adult/child' homosexual sex? >>

In a charming display of his deepest obsessions, Boazy vilifies homosexuals and Muslims in a single rant. This is, of course, precisely the kind of vilification that we all need to be able to tolerate for the sake of social harmony. Of course, such tolerance doesn't preclude pointing out the seriously deranged nature of the source of the vilification.

It seems that every now and again Boazy has to share with the world his obsession with Nambla, but this time he's excelled himself by linking them, in a classic display of twisted logic, with Muslims.

And did Jesus really say " tittie " !?!

Interesting that you decry the distance the thread has moved off-topic, Boaz, then immediately comment on an off-topic item.

>>Clearly the time has arrived for the Shepherd to reach out his hooked stick thing and BRING BACK a few of us to the tooooopiK. How did this morph into 'Global Warming/Gay rights'? RELIGIOUS VILIFICATION is the topic people.. *pinch*... RHIAN... leaping into the "Jesus did not condemn homosexuality" was quite a leap<<

Far from being the self-appointed shepherd, Boaz, you appear to be just another sheep.

And not a very convincing one, either.

>>Jesus condemned a number of specific behaviors, but He 'generally' condemned 'Immorality'<<

In response to the statement "Jesus did not condemn homosexuality", this is pretty weak. It is you who has decided that homosexuality is immoral, not Jesus.

To assume that because you, Boaz, hold a particular opinion on homosexuality, then by definition Jesus would hold the same view, is just a little presumptuous, wouldn't you say?

Lèse majesté, even.

Your further excursion into off-the-topic territory via NAMBLA was typical of you, and equally irrelevant.

>>If you accept that homosexual behavior is ok, then why not those who enjoy such homosexual fun with little boys?<<

This is like saying "if you consider eating dinner is ok, then why not accept that eating lightly-sautéed baby seals is cool too?"

But please, don't take my word for any of this, since I don't hold any of your Christian prejudices. Here are a few observations on the absence of biblical justification for your homophobic stance, written by (shock horror) a gay Reverend.

http://www.soulforce.org/article/homosexuality-bible-gay-christian

Let me know your thoughts, won't you?

Runner

I’m intrigued at your drawing a distinction between those for whom social exclusion is a result of their own “choice” and those for whom it isn’t. Jesus made no such distinction, forgiving the sins of the sick before he healed them (Matthew 9.3), pronouncing forgiveness of sinners without demanding that they first repent (Luke 7.47), inviting himself into the home of a tax gatherer for a meal (John 19.5) and using a woman of dubious sexual history to evangelise a Samaritan town (John 4).

I believe that the one who said “I came not to judge the world, but to save the world” (John 12.47) and “do not judge, and you will not be judged; do not condemn, and you will not be condemned” (Luke 6.37) had a very different view of humanity and sin than the one you ascribe to him.

Paul, though, is a different case. His values reflect the culture of a moderately cosmopolitan 1st century Palestinian. In some respects he was quite radical – for example his insistence at the equal status of gentiles and Jews – but in other respects he was a fairly conservative, and his views on modest dress, women covering their hair and being silent in religious gatherings etc are products of the culture of that time. Nowadays, all but the most reactionary churches happily disregard his instructions on these matters. In my view, his attitude to homosexuality belongs in the same category – a product of its time that we are not obliged to obey. We now understand that homosexuality is intrinsic to a person’s nature, not a lifestyle choice or deviancy. I do not believe that Jesus would condemn someone for feelings and attractions that are essential to their personhood, nor that he would try to impose on them a lifestyle of denial and repression.