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The Forum > Article Comments > The war for children’s minds > Comments

The war for children’s minds : Comments

By Stephen Law, published 21/8/2007

If authoritarian political schools are utterly beyond the pale, why are so many of us prepared to tolerate the religious equivalents?

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Aqvarivs –If you are not of that persuasion its none of your business.
I believe that each child has the right to the full development of his or her potential. That outcome is not likely if their parent has been subject to indoctrination and is intent on passing on the indoctrinated beliefs instead of genuine knowledge and a spirit of enquiry. Parents don't own their children. They hold each of them in trust for the child's future.
Chainsmoker –Evolution isn’t just the greatest hoax of our times. Its been a great hoax for billions of years.
The Theory of Evolution only came into being 150 years ago. Science now accepts this theory to nearly the same degree that it accepts the theory of gravity or of thermodynamics.
Communicat- Constitution does not permit the making of laws about religion
The Constitution does allow laws on education and behaviour with children and such laws are what are required.
Kenny – Never argue with a fool
I present my arguments with the aim of enlightening the thinkers and waverers. I agree some people are beyond help and I use them as a foil.
Posted by Foyle, Wednesday, 22 August 2007 5:08:18 PM
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The mesmerism that the universe [one song] is all coincidental and no thing was meant to be isn't worth the price of the magicians hat. All things is a fluke? That there is no nature of all things? A conspiracy of flukes? Or you believe in design because the nature of something predisposes that all things are inclined. The disposition to do or be by design. Like the innate talents given to each and every child that will hopefully with proper parenting and mentoring see each child into a mental and emotional successful adulthood.
There is no war for the minds of the children. It is a battle between competing adults to see who will directly influence the child not for the sake of the child but, for the self-gratification of the adult. Be that mother, father, teacher or preacher. Though these like are the minority, they demand the most attention by the use of terror tactics that would put the Mongol hordes to shameful incompetence. The minority rule through the generation of fear of the minority who cause all strife. We do not have general fears. We have specific fears directed to a minority of ill behavior found in all institutions directed by political expediency and not directed to the benefit of the individual. Several teachers are actually needed per class but, at 60,000 a year and full union, the cost would make education a thing for the very wealthy. So we are stuck with probably what are or were good people of good intent who have become authoritarian for their own survival.
Posted by aqvarivs, Wednesday, 22 August 2007 5:12:06 PM
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I was not intending to sound glib and self righteous. My apologies if it came over like that.
I really do believe that some sound basics so that children feel confident about reading, writing and maths are essential. I also believe that children should have a good grounding in a community language other than English, world affairs with enough history and geography to understand them in context, some basic science so they have an understanding of the physical world and some skills in music, art, craft and physical education that is not based on being good enough to be picked for the sports team. A little logic and morals would do no harm although some would argue the latter should come from parents.
My worry is that schools are so busy teaching social education and rights before responsibilities or reading that children do not have the cultural literacy with which to understand their rights or their responsibilities.
Posted by Communicat, Wednesday, 22 August 2007 5:33:55 PM
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Foyle, the arrogance and self-righteousness of your belief exceeds that of any average person of faith. I'd put you right up there with the fundamental religionists. Of course by the sound of it you have been heavily indoctrinated so you don't actually believe in anything but rather are spouting the party line ground into you by your nihilist upbringing or petty rebellion. Whichever, the damage well done.

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy. But come;
Here, as before, never, so help you mercy,
How strange or odd soe'er I bear myself,
As I perchance hereafter shall think meet
To put an antic disposition on,

That you, at such times seeing me, never shall,
With arms encumber'd thus, or this headshake,
Or by pronouncing of some doubtful phrase,
As 'Well, well, we know,' or 'We could, an if we would,'
Or 'If we list to speak,' or 'There be, an if they might,'
Or such ambiguous giving out,
Posted by aqvarivs, Wednesday, 22 August 2007 5:34:51 PM
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Perhaps instead of looking at whether public versus private schools represent a propaganda battle, we should consider the conditions under which each operate.
State schools must take and keep the students enrolled there, regardless of their behaviour.
Private schools do not. Their teachers do not have to accept verbal and physical abuse, disruptive behaviour, and do not have to work within a bureaucratic, not merit-based, system.
It is understandable why so many parents would prefer to send their children to private schools. In many cases it has nothing to do with the philosophical bias of the school but of the safety of the child and the liklihood that it will enjoy the better educational environment.
Diana
Posted by Diana, Wednesday, 22 August 2007 7:51:38 PM
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Great article. I loved the analogy with political thought.

The problem with this whole debate regarding religious education is that whenever as a parent you voice objections you are immediately branded as some immoral anti-religious being when that is not actually at issue.

As Jolanda pointed out it not necessarily the religion, but how it is presented and by whom. A child’s spiritual upbringing should be primarily the responsibility of the parents. Not schools. Schools at most should be just an adjunct to this and only with the knowledge of parents. Schools are there to Educate. Educate in the classical sense-to expand and broaden the world of children.

My eldest son went to a private non-denominational school and finished his last two years doing the International Baccalaureate (IB) http://www.ibo.org/. He loved it, and found it very stimulating and wished he could have done it his entire school life. He claims he learnt more in those 2 years then he did in 10 years of ‘Christian’ teaching.

My daughter is at a public High School which hopefully will be ready to start the IB by the time she is in year 10. There is no way she is going to finish any school doing any State’s curriculum. I’m with Chris on this. The IB will lift standards.
Posted by yvonne, Wednesday, 22 August 2007 8:30:01 PM
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