Having just commented on the other HP essay, I thought I ought to say, Sophie, that you found more in the first novel than I did. I won't repeat what I wrote in the other post, but I do agree that kids like excitement, imagination and action (they like comics on TV, too). It no longer suprises me that there is out there a small army of people who 'disapprove' of what children read. They have done it about Enid Blyton and W. E. Johns, and they do it now about J. K. Rowlings. On the whole, I would urge them to get a life.

Ah, some common sense entering the debate about HP. There were no less than seven adults reading HP7 in my half of the railway carriage this morning.
For those of you who want to read a slightly more sophisticated version try Diana Wynne Jones - a rather underrated author who should have more prominence and who manages to do it successfully for children as well as adults.
And for those of you baby boomers pining for the books of your childhood look up Fidra Press on the 'net...there must be a market for these things...yes, the good old adventure story.

PART I OF II:
The realm of the occult will be "greek" to anyone who doesn't recognize the existence of two kinds of spirits: The Spirit of God, which recognition requires belief that the human race was created by a Creator God (which requires in turn that one read and believe Jesus raised the putrefied (liquifying) body of his friend Lazarus back to life at a command (as only a Creator might) -- and then the other kind of spirit, those kicked out of God's presence because they wanted to BE him (fallen angels).

In the Bible (for those who believe) God warns humans not to tamper or interact with fallen angels. Why? One, they hate humans, but will never tell them this. Two, they are infinitely smarter than humans, and regularly outsmart them, leading some occult "masters" to believe they control these spirits, when it is the other way around.

In the film Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix, Harry is possessed by a spirit and Harry kicks the spirit out by sheer willpower. This is not possible in the real world of the spirit -- the occult realm. This is only the fallen spirit version (the lie) that the fallen spirit will leave a human body if that human tells it to go. Not so. The fallen spirit can only be commanded by its creator. That's right, Jesus, or a human initiating the order in Jesus's name.

This is the reason why there is a ritual of exorcism using the name of the Lord. The exorcist commands the fallen angel out in the name of
Jesus Christ. The FA must obey. Why? He is being told to leave by the one who created him, who is the only one who can "uncreate"
or destroy him.
It is nothing less than ignorance, or hubris to believe FA are fearful of humans. They are not. What does a spirit with superhuman strength and superhuman intelligence have to fear from humans (unless the latter have superhuman backing)?

PART II OF II

Recall the excerpt from the Bible where the (occult) spirits possessing a man cry out in fear as Jesus approaches, they then remind him that their time is not yet come (not yet time to be destroyed by God), asking Jesus what he wants with them (high anxiety).

The Bible is nothing if not consistent about the occult realm. Why? because there are certain realities that no amount of human denial or ignorance can change. The spirits are created beings. They are very powerful, and they are very unhappy with human beings (who unlike them, are given an opportunity to be saved)-- and they seek to destroy them.

While the Harry Potter novels pretend that humans can control the occult (meaning control fallen angels) this is a lie (told by whom? the fallen angels of course, or those influenced by them). Comments about the harmlessness of the HP books and the idiocy of talk about demonic spirits have no basis in occult reality. Fallen angels have no ethics. They really don't care how many human lives they destroy, or how young those lives might be (witness the advice of "psychic" Sylvia Brown who claims (or her occult spirit does) that committing suicide is "okay" because suicides automatically go to the "other side"). Mislead, then destroy.

Draw an illusory, mistaken map of the supernatural realm, in order that humans who follow that "map" will be destroyed spiritually and physically. That's the true consequence of the Harry Potter novels, from the point of view of God, who knows everything about the supernatural realm he created.

Find a reliable map made by a reliable mapmaker. FA are not reliable because of their unrevealed malice and hatred of humans, young and old. By the way, the "wands" used in HP do not direct human energy. They appear to direct energy, but this energy is supernatural and demonic (yes, that's right, demonic as in belonging to fallen angels). Humans are easy to fool, especially when they feel they lack power, and can gain it with... (wands).

Hawaiilawyer have you ever heard of the terms 'fiction', 'fantasy', 'fun' and 'imagination'? If you have then do you believe they should be denied for some mediaeval man made idea of theology?
HP is fiction. It is meant to be fantastic (in the true sense of the word). The characters in it are not perfect and they make mistakes but the forces for good overcome the forces for evil. They give kids some hope alongside a story which is imaginative and inventive to the last.
Is HP great literature? Probably not...but I sometimes wonder whether we mistakenly venerate Jane Austen, Charles Dickens and even William Shakespeare merely because it is old and has survived. There are undoubtedly passages of great writing in all three - but is all of it great literature?

Hawaiilawyer the Bible is fiction, gods ,angels and spirits are mythological fantasy although are also superstitious fetishes.

I would never let a child read the Bible , it contains hard core violence , incest and racist and mysoginist over tones. In English the Bible is poorely written which sets a bad example to school children.

By contrast what I have read of Harry Potter , Harry Potter is vastly a superior book. The notable thing about Harry Potter is that Children although enjoys the book know it is only fiction. By contrast the Bible is extremely childish and yet there are a few adults who believe it is real.

Thus Harry Potter (inc) is the lesser of two evils.

your 'post' comment's regardin the potter books are succinct west.
I was raised a catholic and went through all the 'rites' _all very embarassing and totally discinnected to contemporary life. My daughter enjoys the potter books still even though she is now 20.religion is passe in my opinion, we have entered a new age of thought and reason,unfortunatly some people will always be left behind.
ciao

Part I of II

JK tracks occult practices of occult masters. The outer presentation to you may be fiction, but the underlying material is spiritual reality. If you do not believe in the existence of the invisible, try taking yourself back before the invention of the microscope, when germs were unknown because invisible. The doctor who recommended to other doctors that they wash their hands before cutting up people was ridicul
ed and ostracized. That did not make the existence of germs a "non-fact."

There are many who believe that Jesus could not possibly have raised a
man dead four days back to life with a command. Comparing Jesus to every other human in order to grasp who he is, is "human-centric." He is God and man, sent to inform a generally obstinate and generally deaf humanity. It is our deafness that required he appear in our form, among other reasons.

All humans have a bent to harm others, by comission or just by failing to help. Human standards of right and wrong are rosy colored, imperfect. Humans are unjust, they favor their own wrong behavior, for which reason Jesus calls all men (and women) to repent (change). This means, be realistic about human nature, recognize the need for change because of the human penchant for doing wrong, and accept supernatural help.

Whether or not you know it, you are on one side of a spiritual war. Your being on one side doesn't require your recognition of what is happening to you, and what will happen when you die. All men are appointed to die, and then the judgment of God. This reality doesn't require your belief. It is a prediction of your future. God never lies. He informs all of this through the Bible, before you die. This is a measure of his compassion. The reason he came is he has a merciful side and he is a God of wrath. Wrath at sin, at injustice, at wrongdoing.

See part II

Part II of II

Source: Thomas B. Allen, "Possessed -- The True Story of an Exorcism"

Excerpt:

"At home, Robbie was always on the scene just as something mysterious happened. A coat on a hanger seemed to fly out of a closet and across a room. A Bible seemed to rise from a bookcase and land at Robbie's feet. He was standing nearby when others saw an orange and a pear fly across a room. One day the kitchen table tipped over....

"One Sunday relatives came calling. They were all in the living room when the large stuffed chair Robbie was sitting in seemed to rise slightly off the floor then flip over. Robbie somersaulted onto the floor. Stunned, family members gathered around the chair. Robbie's father and uncle each sat in the heavy chair and tried to flip it over. Each man failed.

"When the family members were still talking about the flipping chair,one of them pointed to a small table. A vase was slowly rising from the table. It seemed to hang in the air for a moment. Then it flew across the room and shattered against a wall....

"Something was happening to Robbie. But what? His frantic parents tried to explain the phenomena as mischief, tricks that he learned from some book on magic. Again and again, Robbie said, 'I didn't do it! I didn't do it!' But no one in school had believed him when he said that, and now it was happening at home...."

This actual case of spirit possession occurred in l949, was dramatized in the film, "The Exorcist," and the phenomena it describes parallels phenomena in the HP books, fiction though the latter may be.

The HP books seek to minimize the seriousness of occult practices and what participation in them can lead to (spirit influence) by creating fictional characters who are unlikeable and totalitarian, as well as biased against "harmless" occult practices.

(source: iUniverse.com)

Hawaiilawyer -

If such guff were indeed true, I would take the messages of the Harry Potter books over those ravings you posted any day of the week.

Call me an evil one who consorts with fallen angels if you wish.

Funnily enough, in the HP series, the evil Lord Voldemort tries to convince the world that his pure-blooded way is for the greater good.

Yet it is those who cast off his dogma and embrace their own ability to reason and see what is the moral thing to do.

So consider me this doing exactly that. Casting off your dogmatic tripe in favour of what is clearly an honest story with wholesome messages at its end.