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The Forum > Article Comments > Climate change denial > Comments

Climate change denial : Comments

By Clive Hamilton, published 3/5/2007

Most Australians are no longer in a state of denial: they are facing up to the truth about global warming.

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"Perseus and his denialist buddies" ... perhaps I am being presumptuous in assuming that I might be included in that company, however I suspect I am - although perhaps not by Perseus himself. All I deny is that the hypothesis that the present phase of global warming has been proved to a reasonable scientific standard to be anthropogenic. Does that make me a denialist?

"Are they denying that volcanic activity affects climate change where volcanic emissions are just 1% of human-induced emissions?" No! Clearly it does; and even better for science there is an established mechanism. Dust in the upper atmoshere - which is where most of it goes after being shot out of a volcano - reflects heat and causes major cooling for a period of time. This has followed all of the major volcanic eruptions in history. The cooling after the last Krakatoa blast is a good example.

"Are they claiming that anthropogenic pollution is good for the environment and human health?" No! Although this question is hardly worth an answer.

"Are they insisting that man-made pollution does not affect the climate?" No! Everything in a closed system affects everything else - remember the concept of the butterfly flapping its wings and causing a cyclone somewhere else. The question is of degree, and of certainty. Clearly CO2 is a GHG, and will therefore have an influence. What is not understood, and therefore not modelled, is the extent to which competing secondary effects come into play in global warming.

"Are they recommending that we continue to pollute the entire planet, desecrating everything necessary to sustain life on earth?" You might like to take a few deep breaths and ponder whether you really believe this.
Posted by Reynard, Tuesday, 8 May 2007 2:56:45 PM
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Good post Reynard...although you forgot dickie's last 2 questions.

"Mmmmmm.....bright lads these sceptics - aren't they!?" ...Not sure I like where you're going with that question.

"What ever the're on......could I have some too, please?" No you've had enough for this week.
Posted by alzo, Tuesday, 8 May 2007 3:44:49 PM
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So what's your problem Reynard?

The strategy for mitigating anthropogenic pollution to restore our eco systems, is the same for reducing A/CO2.

It matters not whether we're in an ice age or being cooked alive with global warming!

Do you know anything about the catalytic and secondary effects of the origins of CO2? Polycyclic aromatic and aliphatic hydrocarbons, VOC's, PM? Most of those chemicals are carcinogenic, mutagenic or teratogenic.

Then you have the effects to climate from SO2 and NOx's. Oh I forgot to mention atmospheric CO which elevates methane and ozone prior to converting to CO2.

Would you like to reflect on the ecological destruction resulting from the effects of man-made persistent organic pollutants such as polychlorinated dibenzo-p-dioxins and furans? Or the negative effects on our eco systems, wildlife, livestock and humans from the excessive emissions of heavy metals?

"Computer modelling" to prove we've damaged the troposphere, stratosphere and ionosphere? Hey Reynard.....what planet are you on? We've already done that!
Posted by dickie, Tuesday, 8 May 2007 3:49:28 PM
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"Do you know anything about the catalytic and secondary effects of the origins of CO2?"
Oh I'd love to know all about them....please share

"we've damaged the troposphere, stratosphere and ionosphere"
We've damaged the ionsphere as well?....
Posted by alzo, Tuesday, 8 May 2007 4:08:21 PM
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We must look at the solutions which are available today. It's time for political parties to act. First Carbon Trading must be seen as a short term solution, giving industry time to adjust to new technology. Both Federal and State Governtments must raise the rebates for solar panels to 50% of the cost for residential owners and as a tax deduction for industry. In other words it must be made compulsory for all new residential and industrial properties. All major rivers should come under a National Water Board independent of government but finance by Federal, State and Local Governments. Making it illegal to divert water as well as the use of dams, weirs and locks to control it. The Federal Government needs to provide incentitives for industry to develop alternate fuels and to produce vehicles to run on such fuels. To make it illegal for industry to acquire patents for new technology and not to develop there use immediately in order to product itself. These are but a few which can be used now.
Posted by southerner, Tuesday, 8 May 2007 5:31:37 PM
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Dickie has a little chat with himself, asking and answering his own questions, and then responds as if I had given the answers he gave. Brilliant, Dickie, keep that up and you will disappear right up your own backside to the point where you'll get fan mail from black holes.

I may be labelled as a sceptic but I am foremost and auditor of public debate and reference checker of claims. And the fact that great wads of the utterances of "spivanthropus climatensis" simply do not stack up makes it clear that these people have a credibility problem. Another day another stupid climate cretin pops up with a new "Scarenario" to frighten the kids.

But don't try to characterise my position as being in denial. I just have a firm rule in both life and business. Never, ever, do business with spivs and parasites.
Posted by Perseus, Wednesday, 9 May 2007 12:27:22 PM
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