Vegemite made by the chinese. That's gotta be wong.

I believe that there is too much "dumping" going on in these threads.

Surely we can respond to each others posts without having to resort to "dumping."

It's just not good enough really.

I remember back in the old dart we never would even consider "dumping".

Pip pip tally ho.

CHINA can teach us a lot......

They have structured their industry in the following ways..

Small parts for various brands of various products are made in HUGGGGGE quantities... (some lever or cog in a printer)

Then they have other manufacturers making complete assemblies, (using the cog produced above) again in HUGE quantities, and for various brands.

They have separated "Marketing" from "Manufacturing" in many cases where marketing groups focus on obtaining the patents, registrations, etc and approvals for access to large overseas markets like the USA.

MARKETING is always GLOBAL.. whether it is cheap hammers, mattocks or whatever.. they produce with every Bunnings Store in the WORLD in mind. We can also and we have the raw materials. Cost of steel+$0.30 X 5,000,000 is still a lot of money. (freight is no more costly)

TRADE MAGAZINES contain all you could ever wish for, in various quality levels..

Most products are produced and marketed in CONTAINER sizes....

I remember being freaked out of my brain in Singapore once when I saw a large TRUCK driving around on the 5th story of a large warehouse.. looked like it was just the balcony.. good use of space..

Singapore is very much a Government guided economy, as is Malaysia.

We in Australia are too embedded in concepts which we regard as 'untouchable' or 'holy' we need to free up our minds.

SOLAR and RENEWABLE energy IS a sector where we can make progress.. but don't too many do it cos I AM :) You can visit my Maximum Power Point Tracking Solar Pumping demonstration in due course. But even Malaysia is producing very crappy and cheap throw away regulators.

DavidB, Col’s analysis is supported by a wealth of evidence. Two specific British examples which stick in my mind. Britain in the late ‘50s had six shipbuilding yards, two viable, four moribund. So the government poured support into the latter four, leading to the collapse of all six. The Mini (car) was a massive seller, but made no money. Why? As part of a deal for a takeover of the old Rootes group (by Chrysler?), the government demanded that they make a mini-car (the Imp) in Scotland. Result: neither the Mini nor the Imp was viable.

The Asian “tigers” - South Korea, Singapore, Hong Kong and (I think) Thailand had three advantages. 1: a government focus on exports – support was dependent on export success; 2: high domestic savings rates (the main source of capital); and 3: a preparedness to move on, to let go of ailing industries and move into new ones. By contrast, the UK and Oz have generally protected declining industries (and still do in Oz), not had high savings rates (and in Oz have tended to invest in unproductive property). The “tigers” also had a big shift from low-productvivity agriculture into higher value added manufacturing and services, and the capacity to import Western technology.

Someone suggested you read The Economist. You can get an online subscription for about $100 – money well spent if you want to comment on economic issues.

David, your theories won't work, you need a comparative advantage.
Our basic infrastructure costs are simply too high to compete with China in manufacturing of commodity factory products. So we are better to stick to niche, higher value products and things like farming and mining.

I bought a cement mixer recently, made in China. For what I need, it will do the job. Its weight was on the box. I also buy alot of steel from Onesteel and I worked out that the cost per kg of that mixer was no more then Onesteel charge for raw steel products.
Heyyy, quit dreaming :)

Now food is a different story. I would never buy food products from China, no matter what they cost, for very good reasons. I think that all Supermarkets should be forced to be much more specific about where their foodproducts are produced, so that we consumers know exactly about origins etc and can make an imformed choice

Boaz, I think Col has pretty well summed up the situation. You suggest that there are "other" reasons why British industry died, and no-one can argue that militant trade-unioninsm and lazy management were contributing factors.

But the concept of "Artificially low labor rates in competing places" simply won't wash.

You also described them in an earlier post as "Chinese dictatorial imposition of artificially LOW labor rates".

In a business sense, there can be no consideration whether the rates are "artificial" (I presume you mean oppressive to the local community) or not, this is simply a value judgement made by an outsider.

Many governments have imposed from time to time restraints upon wages - in the UK it was called a "Prices and Income Policy" - in an effort to ensure their workforce is internationally competitive, but this is only ever effective for a time. Ultimately, market and social forces take over, and incomes rise. This has happened in every market from Taiwan to Thailand over the past few decades, and is a "good thing".

You ask "Where did the CAPITAL come from which enabled them to set up such heavy industries", and the short answer is ODI, overseas direct investment. Foreign companies invest in the local economy specifically to take advantage of lower labour rates, and in doing so bring in technology and knowhow.

Korea is a slight exception - they used overseas borrowing for many years - but eventually saw the light in 1998 with their Foreign Investment Promotion Act. But in the early stages the chaebol were supported by the Banks as they grew.

Did the British contribute to their own problems by exporting knowhow and technology? Possibly. Even probably. But would you suggest that no-one shares knowledge, in case someone can do it better? After all, one of the side effects of growing someone else's economy is that it provides you with a market... they can now afford to buy your stuff, having sold you some of theirs.

Incidentally, the biggest source of ODI in China is.... Taiwan. So you see, it isn't political. Just business.