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The Forum > Article Comments > Moral philosophy v social sciences > Comments

Moral philosophy v social sciences : Comments

By Sarah Flynn-O'Dea, published 8/2/2023

The Enlightenment, ironically, stands out as a turning point where the brilliance of thinkers such as Newton Descartes and Bacon, became a double-edged sword for the humanistic and Logos-centred Liberal Arts.

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The author includes this revealing sentence: "I know how a child's heart leap in the classroom when I mention big ideas like purpose and meaning? You see it is personal but also grand, a reflection of God."

Big ideas are a reflection of God only to a religious believer. I suspect that the author laments the lack of the irrational presence of religion in public education. I along with many others feel education should not include religious indoctrination in the public schools. If a parent wishes that sort of education for a child there are religious schools for that purpose. There is a place for a study of comparative religion in public schools. Students should be aware of what people believe. There should be no place for religious indoctrination in the public schools. I am appalled by the presence of chaplains in the Australian public schools. Religion should not be the business of government and vice versa.
Posted by david f, Wednesday, 8 February 2023 11:58:45 PM
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david f,
Spot-on !
Posted by Indyvidual, Thursday, 9 February 2023 8:47:04 AM
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Hi David f

I agree that state schools should teach children about religions not what to believe; I’d say the same of private schools without an explicit religious affiliation.

It may be different in your state, but here in WA, chaplains in state schools provide pastoral care, not religious instruction. According to the WA department education website, “chaplains may be of any faith or no faith” and must have suitable qualifications in pastoral care of children and youth.
Posted by Rhian, Thursday, 9 February 2023 10:55:43 AM
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Dear Rhian,

Scripture Union, a fundamentalist Christian group, provides chaplains for the WA public schools. They are supposed to provide pastoral care only in all public schools. If I had children of school age I wouldn't trust them.

WA isn't different from other Australian states in regards to the chaplaincy.

https://www.watoday.com.au/national/western-australia/how-your-taxes-ended-up-funding-religious-jobs-in-wa-s-public-schools-20220722-p5b3uh.html
Posted by david f, Thursday, 9 February 2023 1:43:38 PM
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Thanks David, that’s an interesting link.

My reading of it is that there is no requirement for chaplains to be religious, and no bar on people of any religion or none from becoming a chaplain. Only accredited organisations can supply chaplains, and two of the three school accredited organisations in WA are Christian, but there is nothing to prevent other organisations from applying for, and obtaining, accreditation. It could be simpler to remove the requirement for accrediting organisations and recruit chaplains direct, though the article points out that may give rise to conflicts of interest – chaplains need a degree of independence from the school hierarchy.

The article points to some problems with the funding model, and these probably have administrative fixes. However, the main issue seems to be that not many non-religious organisations want to become accredited, because it is not very lucrative. Religious organisations tend to have a commitment to pastoral care that makes them willing to undertake these roles (not just Christians – at university level there are also Jewish, Muslim and Buddhist chaplains). So while I agree with the sentiment (except the “firms”), I'm not sure we'll reach the end the article concludes with – “Maybe eventually there will be multiple firms sourcing the best possible people to help schools safeguard our children’s wellbeing.” .

Surely, the most important thing is what chaplains do, and don’t do. They are not allowed to proselytise, and must respect other people’s values, views and beliefs. They must be professionally qualified. Their role is pastoral care. If they do these things well, does it matter if they do them because they are religious?
Posted by Rhian, Thursday, 9 February 2023 2:51:46 PM
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If a person cannot live without religion, that means he has not yet learned to think logically.
The world at large has existed without religious ideas for a very long time.
Only a few humans with misbegotten principles feel the need to follow a path sustained by lies and half truths.
Which means that path has a shaky foundation, and must inevitably fail those who use it.
Posted by Ipso Fatso, Thursday, 9 February 2023 3:30:24 PM
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