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The Forum > Article Comments > Speaker Pelosi shows how the South Pacific should deal with an aggressive and bullying China > Comments

Speaker Pelosi shows how the South Pacific should deal with an aggressive and bullying China : Comments

By Jeffrey Wall, published 5/8/2022

I'm not a fan of Pelosi but one has to admire how she is responding to the usual threats and bullying from China as a result of her visiting Taiwan with a congressional delegation.

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It is being said that Pelosi has made Biden look weak, and Xi Jinping even weaker. The CCP actions right up to the Taiwanese exclusion zone just because of an old woman's visit are pathetically childish.
Posted by ttbn, Friday, 5 August 2022 8:50:53 AM
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In the real world, as the Opinion Columnist in the New York Times castigated the 83 year old sinophobic megalomaniac, “against President Biden’s wishes, she will be doing something that is utterly reckless, , dangerous and irresponsible.”
Posted by Leslie, Friday, 5 August 2022 9:54:12 AM
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Yes, agree with some reservation. It's all very well for Pelosi to show resolve when see is backed by the biggest most powerful military in the world, one that is nuclear capable and nuclear armed as we should be if we are to stand up to nuclear armed and nuclear capable, bullies!

China has no problem buying influence and subsequent control from cargo cult communities who have the for sale sign out and for virtual pennies. And that being so, only a question of time before China is on our doorstep with military bases and nuclear missiles!

As we prattle on about anything but the real issues like the ever increasing cost of energy, housing and food to name some. And as this occurs create an underclass that will see no valid reason to stand up to anyone, let alone fight for what they have here?

I wouldn't! Nor elect another (anti-nuclear) elbow led, China friendly, labor govt.
Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Friday, 5 August 2022 10:10:18 AM
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There's a solution to the "real" issues I've raised and that is that ultra rapid transition to, cheaper than coal and all the renewables, (1 cent PKWH) MSR thorium energy.

[See LFTR in five minutes on U tube.]

That can also be tasked with burning up nuclear waste other nations will pay us annual millions to take off their hands. And all but free, clean, safe as, carbon free energy for possibly thousands of years!

Will the elbow led, yackidy, yack, blah, blah, blah, (look good on on the international stage) labor party accept such a proposal? No, they will die in a ditch first?

Bugger my poor country!
Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Friday, 5 August 2022 10:55:54 AM
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she will be doing something that is utterly reckless, , dangerous and irresponsible.”
Leslie,
At 83 she is nothing but a selfish old hag with nothing to lose hence her not giving a damn what harm she does for future generations. Hopefully, the Chinese can see that & just waive her aside like the old hag she is. The Chinese have too much cultural heritage & pride not to let the cow ruin it all just because she can no longer be around to stir crap !
With her & Biden gone soon thanks to natural attrition, things will improve !
Perhaps they should milk her venom so, at least a tiny bit of good could come from her.
Posted by Indyvidual, Friday, 5 August 2022 11:11:49 AM
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Alan (first post).

The most sensible proffering of opinion I’ve read from you in a long while.

Dan
Posted by diver dan, Friday, 5 August 2022 12:10:26 PM
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Let small "l" liberal do-gooders like Hanoi Jane. Sorry I meant Taipei Nancy off the leash

and we could have Nuclear World War 3 before you could say American Exceptionalism

http://foreignpolicy.com/2011/10/11/the-myth-of-american-exceptionalism/

Most statements of "American exceptionalism" presume that America’s values, political system, and history are unique and worthy of universal admiration.

The only thing wrong with this self-congratulatory portrait of America’s global role is that it is mostly a myth. By focusing on their supposedly exceptional qualities, Americans blind themselves to the ways that they are a lot like everyone else.

This unchallenged faith in American exceptionalism makes it harder for Americans to understand why others are less enthusiastic about U.S. dominance, often alarmed by U.S. policies, and frequently irritated by what they see as U.S. hypocrisy, while America ignores its own failings.
Posted by Maverick, Friday, 5 August 2022 4:52:40 PM
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When the Japanese bombed Darwin we were as we are now only more so, completely unprepared. We should have had a squadron of spitfires which had been in production for at least two years. And the guns we did have were supplied with ammo not to be used in the tropics. And turned Darwin into a shooting gallery for the invading Nipponese.

Later in the war we could and did build fighter bombers here and used them to good effect in our region of the Pacific!

Today we've leased a port in Darwin to the Chinese and all but invited them in with our real estate sales and economic dependency!

If we had to defend this island continent we would last about two weeks before we ran out of fuel. We could hardly defend our huge coastline without leasing a northern port to the Chinese and giving them a ready made foothold we'd hardly be able to take back without millions of casualties!

Meanwhile the labor PM and the labor foreign Minister strut the world stage firing from, as usual for Ozzie pollies, the lip! And totally unaware of just how dumb and unprepared we ( thanks to head burying them) are now! For a military assault or the coming economic downturn of a size, not seen since the Great Depression!

A warm and comfortable Canberra bubble is the problem and quarantines our "Leaders" from the consequences of their decisions or lack thereof.

Our defense only as good as our "liberated" manufacturing sector! Currently forced elsewhere (almost anywhere else) by the ever increasing cost of economy crippling energy!

If I were a foreign General and Oz in the sights? My target of first choice would be Canberra! With the head cut off the rest would quickly capitulate. Even then we'd hardly be worse off!
Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Friday, 5 August 2022 5:37:33 PM
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If I was in Taiwan I would be very worried.
Can anyone explain why the US is saying it is prepared to assist Taiwan but failed to lift a finger when Russia invaded Ukraine.
Posted by TheAtheist, Friday, 5 August 2022 9:27:45 PM
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TA. The US is giving Ukraine lots of assistance, both economic and military! Try speaking from a little higher up next time.
Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Saturday, 6 August 2022 10:39:47 AM
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TheAtheist,
The US is a good instigator for creating division in other countries & they excel in turning their back after billions of $ worth of their weapons have been sold !
Democracy aids them greatly in this hypocritical game !
Posted by Indyvidual, Saturday, 6 August 2022 10:40:58 AM
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Although it was a good idea for a senior US politician to visit Taiwan to knot up Xi's underpants and give him an even more pouty look, why does the US hang onto old people? Biden is senile, and judging by what Pelosi says and does sometimes indicates that she is off her rocker. 82 years old, for heaven's sake, and still involved in running the greatest country on Earth: the symbol of the free world. I am pushing 80, and I think I'm of at least average intelligence, but I know my limitations. Nobody over 70 should be allowed to run for office; and that includes Donald Trump, who might have another go.
Posted by ttbn, Saturday, 6 August 2022 11:00:55 AM
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It does look as if China does believe there can be a winner in a nuclear war. In this case we are likely to find ourselves at war with them sometime. That it would cost most of us dearly & many our lives is obvious, & perhaps inevitable.

With the huge spend in rapidly expanding their arms, they will out grow us rapidly. Even if we do get those never never nuclear subs, time will only leave us weaker, as we appear mentally incapable of acquiring nuclear arms.

Thus if we are going to go to war with China, the sooner we do it the better. We would suffer less damage the sooner it happens.

I hate the thought of my son being called up to go back into the navy, but better now than in even 5 years time.
Posted by Hasbeen, Saturday, 6 August 2022 1:18:51 PM
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A new book, "Danger on our Doorstep" by Jim Molan will be an interesting read. $14.99 for the ebook on Google Books.
Posted by ttbn, Saturday, 6 August 2022 1:56:50 PM
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All this just because of the stupidity of the educated !
Posted by Indyvidual, Saturday, 6 August 2022 9:21:43 PM
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Hasbeen,
It's pretty clear we will not actually go to war with China, but if China goes to war we will treat them in a similar way to how we currently treat Russia.

Fortunately we aren't such imbeciles that we'd seriously consider acquiring nuclear arms, as this would not only make us targets for a preemptive strke, but would also result in many other countries (including Indonesia) acquiring them. There are few things that would make our position less secure.
Posted by Aidan, Sunday, 7 August 2022 12:11:12 AM
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Aidan,
China has already made the preemptive strike against Australia with the Yuan !
Darwin harbour ring any bells or the many real estate deals ?
Posted by Indyvidual, Sunday, 7 August 2022 8:16:28 AM
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Indy,
What China does with the Yuan is China's business, and I consider it one of Rudd's greatest failures as PM that he sided with the Americans on this issue.
China's investments in Australia comply with Australian law.

What you regard as China's "preemptive strike" killed nobody.
If we went with Hasbeen's strategy, a Chinese preemptive strike could kill millions.
Posted by Aidan, Sunday, 7 August 2022 8:50:33 AM
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War with China is not inevitable, but it is more likely than most Australians think. Don't take any notice of the media or politicians. Read and listen to people who actually know what is going on. Of course, most people will sneer at that advice, so I'm not bothering to give more than hint I already have.
Posted by ttbn, Sunday, 7 August 2022 9:28:06 AM
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One thing that the new government has to be congratulated for is its review of the ADF to ascertain what it needs to do to defend Australia NOW, not two or more decades down the track as it was with the Morrison government. We have the usual purely political comments on the person who will manage the enquiry - worst defence minister ever, yadayada. But we need more assurance than idle talk about a few submarines, a single one of which MIGHT be ready by sometime after 2040, if it is ever decided what brand it will be and where it will be built, by whom.
Posted by ttbn, Sunday, 7 August 2022 10:22:23 AM
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Humans have always had wars and with shrinking resources, land, water etc., we will no doubt have many more, it's in our DNA!

As for war with a militant expansionist China? Our best stratergy is to capitulate first then take to our most rugged country with caves that'll support a guerilla army With bows, arrows and spears. NB Stephen Smith, any honest clear eyed review of our defense readiness, would agree with that summary!

Why? because without a robust manufacturing sector that's all we will be able to produce. And because children, a robust manufacturing sector is totally reliant on truly affordable energy! Something (I'm alright jack) Ozzie Pollies don't get, but particularly the greens and those who suck up to them in their policy decisions! And I know you know who that is!

No battery or pumped supported renewable will support a competitive local based manufacturing sector! You want homemade anything then you will need nuclear power as MSR thorium and with that, power prices as low as 1 cent PKWH! And with energy that cheap alternative fuels made from inexhaustable seawater! The above an absolute essential for a robust porcupine defense posture!
Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Sunday, 7 August 2022 10:45:39 AM
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Aidan my post was nothing to do with strategy, just a simple statement of fact. I doubt many Ozzie wants us to go to war with anyone, let alone an adversary so much stronger than us that the result is obvious.

However China is using the prospect of war to deflect their population from concentrating on their many & increasing problems. I am quite sure that if they come to believe war with us would not bring the US in on our behalf, they will take us, rather like taking candy from a baby.

They need our coal & iron ore, & to a lesser extent our grain. Currently they give us trinkets for those, but it might be easier to just come & take them. Our best hope is for them to realise they need the work involved in making those trinkets to keep their population involved & happy. If that changes, watch out.
Posted by Hasbeen, Sunday, 7 August 2022 11:41:50 AM
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The US-China tech war is escalating.
Of course there were other reasons for Crazy Nancy’s visit, but she had a meeting with Mark Lui, chairman of the Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Corporation (TSMC). Pelosi’s trip coincided with U.S. efforts to convince TSMC – the world’s largest chip manufacturer, on which the U.S. is heavily dependent – to establish a manufacturing base in the US and to stop making advanced chips for Chinese companies.
Taiwan’s autonomy has become a vital geopolitical interest for the U.S, because of the island’s dominance of the semiconductor manufacturing market.
Posted by Leslie, Sunday, 7 August 2022 1:15:40 PM
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Aidan,
Hasbeen's strike would be an Australian one, we're talking about a Chinese preemptive strike that has already occurred.
As the Muslims have proven all over the world, a preemptive strike doesn't necessarily have to be a military one. An economic one is just as effective especially when the people are too stupid to realise what's happening to them !
All you need is to send swarms of unarmed fighting-age men, give them an iphone & call them refugees !
Posted by Indyvidual, Sunday, 7 August 2022 4:04:53 PM
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Hassy,

"Thus if we are going to go to war with China, the sooner we do it the better. We would suffer less damage the sooner it happens."

Is that before or after we "nuk" Pakistan as you proposed previously on the Forum? Is it another case of "get em', before they get us"

Your son might have to wait 30 or 40 years before we can drop him into one of our shiny new nuclear subs.
Posted by Paul1405, Sunday, 7 August 2022 4:10:42 PM
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