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The Forum > Article Comments > What to do with unions? > Comments

What to do with unions? : Comments

By David Hale, published 9/6/2020

Could unions in Australia be a solution to ending poverty? Ensuring workers get good pay and good conditions.

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The modern union movement is nothing more than a management arm of the factory human resouses department.

When grubby low life like Bill Shorten, rob the unionists, the people they work for, with impunity, union effectiveness is dead in the water.
Of course workers won't join up in numbers required for the movement to be effective.

The only hope for reduction of poverty is Government directed redistribution of wealth through taxation.

Best of British on that one!

Dan
Posted by diver dan, Tuesday, 9 June 2020 7:27:46 AM
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PS

There is a lovely naivety around this author which is appealing. Always a good read.

Dan
Posted by diver dan, Tuesday, 9 June 2020 7:34:50 AM
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Interesting issue.

My recent interaction with unions, although I have not been a member since 2008, is that they are out of touch or not that competent.

At my workplace, we are still waiting for the 2019 pay rise, but no cigar yet because of the silly union demands. CPI plus $2 per hour.
for all awards.

While I recognise the historical importance of unions long ago, given workers were indeed exploited, we do now have other mechanisms to ensure some decency in terms of pay conditions, including public opinion (which said goodbye to the Howard Govt I believe over that issue, other welfare assistance, and the Fair Work Commission.

But as a powerful player in key industry sectors, notably the public sector, i believe that a smart trade union movement could play a role in the policy debate assuming it sees the difficulties ahead for Australia.
Posted by Chris Lewis, Tuesday, 9 June 2020 7:47:28 AM
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Your right Chris, unionists indirectly dispensed with John Howard.
That was one of the greatest steps forward for mankind. :-))

Dan
Posted by diver dan, Tuesday, 9 June 2020 7:58:54 AM
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"Could unions in Australia be a solution to ending poverty?".

What an absurd question.
Posted by ttbn, Tuesday, 9 June 2020 9:59:57 AM
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Debatable. With for and against arguments. What would our hospitals be like without a Nurses union? I believe that unions were necessary! And as long as rogue employers exist and persist!? Will have a role!

That said, the workplace that has never ever needed unions to ensure the best possible pay scales and conditions in the good times and job security during all the other times has been, Co-ops! (cooperative capitalism)

Co-ops were the one, stand out, stand-alone, private enterprise, free-market business model. That mostly survived the Great Depression largely intact!

Not known to have ever grown too big to fail, because that business model works best as small business that remains nimble and adaptive. And has a competent CEO!

The one failing has been in inherited membership who brought greed is good individualism to this table, sold out and generally stuffed the whole team enterprise! And for who, enough is never ever enough!

Ditto, rogue employers!

None of the greed is good episodes ever ended well for the preps! Except for the sons and daughters of the millionaire class able to move in, buy up at bargain-basement prices, automate and expand!?

A dollar a litre for milk? Yeah, no prob bro! After all, it's volume that always produces the most profit, not regulated, mandated margins!

This is the captive market corporate model that always comes unstuck, needs a bailout in the bad times! Or quite massive price gouging!

Me? I'd let them go under and be split up, divided among new slimmer leaner co-ops! And a far better, superior alternative to unions and exploitive, extreme capitalism!
Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Tuesday, 9 June 2020 11:36:53 AM
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Poverty is never ever addressed by wage demands of unions nor the price wage spiral that just makes things worse, e.g., housing fuel and electricity costs! And indeed all that those things in turn impact on, transport costs, the price of labour?

Things could and should do to remove poverty and reduce the cost wage spiral that has thus far made most of the manufacturing sector here, less than competitive!

Tax reform that ends forever crippling bracket creep! And should be rolled out as an unavoidable 15% flat tax on all income, earnings/profit. Those existing below the current poverty line receiving some protection by a generous lifting of the tax-free threshold!

Commissions and the paper-shuffling middleman that thrive on this model and armies of commissions earning/impoverished salespeople. Need to be outlawed in government legislation and replaced by salaried salespeople only.

This one reform would eliminate the paper shuffling middleman and halve the cost of living/doing business in this country.

And further assisted in that direction with a direct mandate from the factory to end-user sales and distribution model that eliminates the leaning parasites/middlemen, from the distribution chain!

These are the things we could do now with the stroke of a pen, to quite massively reduce poverty.

Other than that, we could roll out, ASAP, MSR thorium SMR's and with them, the world's cheapest energy along with a hugely resuscitated and exporting manufacturing sector!

And could be done even if a few fully imported experts/poms will claim, no way Hosea.
Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Tuesday, 9 June 2020 12:13:09 PM
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The vast majority of unionists are the public service unionists.
They influence government to act in their self-interest and 'buggar. the rest of us.
James Burnham, in his book, the Managerial Revolution, in 1945, predicted this outcome after the demise of communism.

I look askance at unions and public servants and in horror at public servant unionists.

They are corrupting capitalism and democracy.

They often, at worst lie, or at least appear contradictory
Posted by imajulianutter, Tuesday, 9 June 2020 2:10:15 PM
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Comment to imajulianutter, Tuesday, 9 June 2020 2:10:15 PM

Kudos for your post.
Posted by Canem Malum, Tuesday, 9 June 2020 3:24:05 PM
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The British disease, i.e., militant unionism. buggered Britain!

And with Britain buggered the chief buggerers left and have tried to impose it here?

And succeeded in the coal mining and power generation sector?

Thus we have power-producing monopolies and sold down the river to foreign investors, mining. And with that transition, the dearest energy prices in the world and energy bills often higher than the wages bill.

Along with a consequent exodus from this country of a once robust manufacturing sector. And overseen by incompetent, obliging nincompoop, merely masquerading as competent politicians. Some of the least able, fully imported from the old dart, along with old dart attitudes? And incompetence?

And welded like the fulsome fools they appear to be, to coal?

If we want to change this dynamic, we need to embrace cooperative capitalism, i.e., co-ops and MSR thorium.

Thorium as the most energy-dense material in the world. Delivers everything fusion promised, but failed to deliver. And resisted to the last man standing, by the aforementioned fulsome fools?

Co-ops sound the death knell for unions given it renders them not only unnecessary, but totally counterproductive, in those workplaces!

And where we should be heading if we want a recovery that ends well for all Australians!

Go figure.
Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Saturday, 13 June 2020 11:51:25 AM
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