While one can and does agree and empathize with your position Wendy!

Nowhere is it written that you or any member of the "Christian Lobby." Has any right to decide what another human being will do with her body! Including being forced to incubate a child not wanted/expected nor perhaps afforded!

A Daughter, a single mum could have opted for the easy way out, but instead and due to a strong material instinct not only went full term but gives as much love and care to those kids as possible, or like my own sainted mother, regularly goes without food and other essentials so her babies want for little, even in the face of huge economic disadvantage!

Nowhere do I see the "Christian Lobby" at work here helping her pay exorbitant rent nor an even more exorbitant power bill.

The father of her first child committed suicide, when he seemed to have the world and success at his fingertips, the father of her second and the stand in dad her first daughter craved! Used her most cruelly, then deserted like the nassistic arsehole he really is, but only after the aspiring doctor/anaesthetist, had conned his way into their now hopeless lives!

And all while the do gooders patrol the clinics, where underage mums, rape and incest victims, and those with incompatible tissue types, get their enormously sad lives handed back to them!

And all treated exactly the same by the abysmally ignorant, banner waving control freak crowd, merely pretending to be genuine "Christians?"

At the end of the day we all of us face final judgement, including the same folk who know with the same absolute certainty, that homosexuals choose their life style and sexual orientation!?

To them, well might we say, it must be such a comfort to know you're always right! Even so, get a life, one of your own!
Alan B.

How does the most civilised society in history, carry the the statistic of the highest rate of infanticide in history as a normalit?

People wince when confronted with infanticide by bucket of water, during the one child policy in China. Double standards abound.

Infanticide is infanticide, what matter the degree of sophistication, when considering the method.

It is a state of the inconceivable, with a waiting list for adoptions forcing couples overseas and into nebulous, and at times dangerous situations, to achieve a successful adoption, that abortions are not factored in to the adoptions “mix”, by law.

Diver if an underage, incest or rape, date rape produced pregnancy, if carried full term , cost a kid her degree, her promising career and dramatically superior pay packet? Why should any of the above be forced to go full term just so some orphanage can get their hands on a few more adoptable children.

You and your comment tells us you completely lack normal human empathy for the mothers?

It'd be a very different story if these orphanages emptied as quickly as they filled! And what about mums and bubs with incompatible tissue types that would likely kill both of them if the pregnancy went full term? No get out of jail free card, there either?

Simply put, it's just not as black and white as you make out to be! And sometimes the product of alleged consent, but only with a condom, and where the condom is knowingly not used?

Surely those who make women pregnant have to take some responsibility for whole of life outcomes, instead of simply whining, she didn't want my baby? Wouldn't let me near my baby? And perhaps with good reason?

It's surely hard to be completely objective and fair, with so much skin in the game?

Or are you just another, hiding behind a bible, deadbeat dad, trying to blame all else for your own very obvious, shortcomings?
Alan B.

Alan B

Our civilisation, State sanctions the "murder" of babies.

Does that NOT ring an alarm bell with the CEO, in the head office of your Chinese cracker factory?

So extrapolate that out. What other unwanted group of the unwanted and unclean, should we murder? The homeless maybe?

I'm a bloke, and I know that. It's amazing that a woman doesn't; but then, all the ignorant blah we get from media hacks is amazing (as in totally out of whack). The best way to educate yourself is to stop reading newspapers, including The Australian, which has lately overlooked the fact that it is supposed to be conservative.

I'm not sure of the numbers involved in the authors “most women” (abortion decision), but it seems to me that a lot of females use it because they are too stupid to take preventative measures. Those who do this are not only stupid, they are totally amoral; and, perhaps, it is just as well they that don't get to have children.

I'm please to see DD using the word 'infanticide', because that's exactly what abortion is. Yes. While it is, I believe, valid to save the life of a woman – in very few instances – abortion is now a matter of convenience for females not wanting their unnatural competition with males to be hindered by children.

before I respond I'd like the term 'murder' defined beyond,

'Murder is the unlawful killing of another human without justification or valid excuse, especially the unlawful killing of another human being with malice aforethought.'

'cos if the law of the land says killing, terminating,....pick any other word, under certain circumstances is permitted, then it's permitted.

Now if we are going to use 'social morality' then as morality changes from year to year so to are the permissions, so as usual it's always the minority telling the majority how to live because they know better.

At some point between the moment the sperm enters the egg and the time the head crowns, the lifeform growing in the womb becomes human. Prior to that point, ending that lifeform is regrettable but morally acceptable.

After that point, ending the lifeform, which is now human, is regrettable and morally unacceptable. Deliberately killing a human without just cause is murder.

So the issue for society is determine the point at which a human exists. Up to that point, abortion for any reason is allowable (though regrettable). After that point, abortion for any reason ought to be a crime.

really strange how Trump has far more decency than the women marching around wearing vaginas on their heads demanding their right to tear apart unborn babies. And yet the media still back the vagina heads. Planned parenthood far more concerned about their funding than the lives of children. No wonder they cried so much when Hilary lost.

The most important thing here is that it is time these opinionated do gooders got the hell out of other people's lives & shut the hell up.

Most of us have no interest in who the hell this Wendy Francis is, or what she thinks gives her the right to try to dictate to any one else, what their morals should be.

Her resume tells us her life has been spent trying to interfere where she has no right to stick her busy body nose.

Pull your head in Wendy Francis, & mind your own business

//really strange how Trump has far more decency than the women marching around wearing vaginas on their heads//

Is this what you think a vagina looks like, runner?

http://images.prod.meredith.com/product/93858156f03881ca1ddb6e8a35ef2e12/1507369582116/l/pussy-hat-pink-pussy-hat-pussy-hat-project-kitty-hat-pussy-cat-hat-support-womens-rights-production-time-is-12-weeks

It does explain a lot about you.

Speaking of the Women's Marches, I did like the placard one of the protesters was waving which read "If you take away my birth control I'll just make more feminists". Something for those opposed to women's reproductive rights to consider.

keep up the good work Wendy. There is hope that future generations might become sickened by their parents/grandparents total lack of morals and revolt in a good way.

no surprise that you would support such a vulgar nasty excuse for hatred Toni. Not one bit of sympathy for truely oppressed women in Islamic nations just putried bile poured out on any decency. All class!

Every human being has a heartbeat! Before that occurs it is just human tissue with the potential to become a human. The removal of unwanted human tissue is not murder nor infanticide any more than the removal of a leg or a lung for the preservation of the life of the owner of the gangrenous leg or diseased lung.

Women cannot get pregnant without some help, usually a male, not considerate enough to wear a condom.

I always had couple of emergency use condoms in my wallet for those occasions when the forces of instinctive natural arousal wouldn't be controlled or denied! And it's exceedingly hard for a female to wear one and almost impossible to oblige a fully aroused male to wear one.

Moreover it's often surprising how quickly a sexually aroused female will acquiesce at the sight of a condom!

Without which, hardly her fault she got pregnant! Some commenting here seem to believe a women can always say no, while simultaneously, denying them that right? Including the use of rohypnol in cases of date rape!

I've heard the usual piss weak, she was looking for it, excuse until I'm sick of it.

A babe wearing a bikini on a beach is not automatically looking for anything except a healthy tan and a full dose of vitamin D!

Folk who think otherwise need to leave their medieval thought processes, where they belong, in the dark ages!

A woman can't get pregnant by herself and no drunk, wife rapeing bastard/deadbeat dad, has the right to demand she go full term!
Alan B.

Thank you Wendy.

Life begins at conception.
Personhood begins with Life.

Coincidentally came across this today:

http://www.lifezette.com/faithzette/five-things-liberals-dont-want-american-women-know-about-abortion/

//no surprise that you would support such a vulgar nasty excuse for hatred Toni.//

It's just a hat, dude. Chill out.

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Dear Wendy,

.

You wrote :

« Revealing a most unfortunate lack of understanding and information, Samantha Maiden … [stated] … that a surgical procedure often necessary following a miscarriage is the same procedure as an abortion. This is simply not true. There is a massive difference between a curette for a miscarriage and an abortion …»
.

I have no idea what the procedures are, Wendy, but I see one common characteristic of both miscarriage and abortion : they are both human dramas.

The obvious difference between the two is that miscarriages are usually not deliberately provoked by the pregnant person herself, whereas abortions are usually carried-out with the pregnant persons approval.

Considering that almost all miscarriages are due to natural accidents, apart from the deep regret that one may have, there is not much more to be said about them.

When decisions to abort are carried-out by qualified medical practitioners, it is usually for one or more of the following reasons :

• Serious health risk for the pregnant person

• Foetus has a serious disability

• Poverty, pregnant person too young, or unable to cope with a child (or another child)

• Pregnancy the result of a crime, an accident, imposed by partner, or child not wanted

• Pregnancy less than 20 weeks

Some, many or all of these reasons may not be acceptable to religious devotees such as yourself, but they are to society at large whose ethical values are not determined by religious dogma.

The 2003 Australian Survey of Social Attitudes (AuSSA) found that 81% of those surveyed believed a woman should have the right to choose whether or not she has an abortion. It also found that religious belief and support for legal abortion are not mutually exclusive, with 77% of those who identify as religious also supporting a woman’s right to choose.

Here is the link :

http://www.childrenbychoice.org.au/factsandfigures/attitudestoabortion#r1

Need I add that abortion in Australia has always been regulated by state (previously colonial) law, and is not devoid of a certain degree of hypocrisy.

.

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Abortion in Australia

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Here are the essential facts on abortion

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TYPES OF ABORTION

Surgical - can be performed up to between 20 to 24 weeks gestation, depending on legislation

Medical – can be administered up to nine weeks gestation and can be done at home except in South Australia and the Australian Capital Territory
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LEGISLATION

Abortion laws vary between states and territories.

It has been effectively decriminalised in Victoria, the Australian Capital Territory, Tasmania, South Australia, Western Australia and the Northern Territory.

It remains in the criminal code in Queensland and New South Wales, but can be performed in these states under certain circumstances.
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COSTS

Costs vary, depending on geography and gestation. In urban areas and when they are performed by private providers, a first trimester surgical or medical abortion usually costs between $250-$400. This is what most women would pay in Brisbane, Sydney, Perth and Melbourne. Outside of major population areas, for example Tasmania and North Queensland, or regional areas, abortions of both kind can cost much more. In Rockhampton for example, a medical abortion costs above $700. In places where they can be provided publicly, like South Australia and the Northern Territory, they are free.
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Late term abortions can be especially hard to access and women may be flown interstate to get them.
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HOW OFTEN DO THEY HAPPEN ?

There is no specific Medicare number for abortions – they are lumped in with other gynaecological procedures including treatment of miscarriage. Because of this it is difficult to accurately measure the number that occur each year.

According to Children by Choice, a Queensland-based counselling service: "The lack of accurate information about abortion rates makes it difficult to plan for service delivery and to monitor whether public health interventions are successful in reducing the unplanned pregnancy and abortion rate, at both state and national levels."
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EXCLUSION OR SAFE ACCESS ZONES

Exclusion or safe access zones banning protests, violent acts of intimidation and aggression by religious fanatics, within about 150m of abortion clinics, are in place except in WA, NSW and Queensland.

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30 years jail for a miscarriage

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A woman from El Salvador who was jailed for 30 years after suffering a miscarriage in a field, has been pardoned by the courts - the latest sign of change in a nation known as the worst place in the world for women’s reproductive rights.

Ms Tabora is one of dozens of women who have suffered at the hands of the court in the strictly Catholic country, one of just a handful of nations whose anti-abortion laws make no exceptions for rape, incest or the health of the mother.

Sonia Tábora was just 20 when she went into premature labour at seven months and gave birth alone in a coffee plantation, having suffered a miscarriage. Her family found her collapsed and bleeding, and the baby was born dead or died soon afterwards.

Her family took her to a health centre, fearful for her life. But doctors there accused her of carrying out an abortion, something that is strictly illegal in El Salvador. She was shackled to her bed and the police were called.

Three out of eight (37.5%) maternal deaths in El Salvador are suicides by pregnant girls under 19 years of age.

Here is the full story :

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/el-salvador-miscarriage-abortion-strictest-laws-in-world-sonia-t-bora-a7584671.html

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When those demanding a woman must bring a baby into the world, step up and
help bear the next 20year financial and work burden of caring for that child, they have the right to voice their opinion.

I always say about this "right to life idea," that without modern medicine, nature would have wiped out half the population of the world by now.
It was only 150 years ago that they didnt have penicillin and a simple scratch that got infected and poisoned your blood stream, could kill you. All those diseases that had no vaccinations could kill you too. As could the flu. There were no antivenoms for snake and spider bites. Operations would mostly likely kill you because of infection.and thousands of women died in childbirth because of infection. A tooth infection could bore up into your brain and kill y you too

The life expectancy in the old cementaries was usually under 30years and many, many young children and babies were in those cemetaries.

So. i think this "right to life", doesnt really exist on this planet, in the natural world, it is only
an inflated opinion humans have of their specialness.

Having made those observations, I dont like the idea of late term abortions and think there should be a 4month maximum time limit put on it, where possible.