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The Forum > Article Comments > The rape of East Timor: 'Sounds like fun'. > Comments

The rape of East Timor: 'Sounds like fun'. : Comments

By John Pilger, published 29/2/2016

Secret documents found in the Australian National Archives provide a glimpse of how one of the greatest crimes of the 20th century was executed and covered up.

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You found some secret document John?

That must have been exciting, breaking into secret vaults in the dead of night and beating all our security, both electronic and canine assisted patrols?

Did they fall off the back of a truck John, or did your polonium producing mates in the Kremlin produce some realistic forgeries for you to make entirely vexatious mischief with in order to simply delay the development of the significant new horison oil and gas fields?

I mean we all "see" where your real loyalties lay, and just how much the depressed oil prices are hurting oil revenue dependant Russia economically; and who needs to see a brand new oil and gas fields opened up like a hole in the head!

Keep stirring john, who knows you might even succeed in convincing someone, someday somewhere?

Maybe your very special friend, Mr (pot of gold at the end of the rainbow) Putin?
Rhrosty.
Posted by Rhrosty, Monday, 29 February 2016 9:01:22 AM
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Rhrosty, he may have a point, but I find I treat what I read with a healthy degree of scepticism. Especially when the way it is written targets the emotional strings.

Emotions are not facts.
Posted by Wolly B, Monday, 29 February 2016 9:38:03 AM
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Rhosty, good to see that when you can't attack what the author has written you are happy to attack the author instead.
Posted by Carz, Monday, 29 February 2016 10:20:00 AM
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My apologies, Rhrosty, my spelling of your name in my original post was incorrect.
Posted by Carz, Monday, 29 February 2016 10:21:19 AM
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WollyB, Pilger has developed a terrible reputation that must surely make propaganda promulgating Putin Puke?

He is one of those who defend Assange, gloss over his patent criminality or complete lack of verification, normal in accurate investigative journalism, and generally done, with one or two notable exceptions, to sensationalise the ordinary or mundane.

Simply put East Timour needs an agreement they can live with, on the table!

And even in spite of the unproven allegations of spying, they had one and could've earned some money when higher oil prices could have meant more lucrative cash flow contracts.

Simply put, we had a marine boundary, and the spy allegations, whether true or just so much mischief; have been used as an oh so convenient vehicle to change an agreed legal contract!

It may be inconvenient, but our continental shelf is part of Australia, regardless of wherever it ends, ditto for every other nation on the planet!

Lower the water level by around 200 feet and it all becomes dry land and an integral part of Australia!

And the natural canyon, between us and East Timor, the natural geological boundary.

Allowing something like the seizure of of part of our continental shelf, which is just as much apart of Australia, as a geologically connected Great Barrier Reef, would create a precedent with all sorts of ramifications pertaining to places like a disputed southern China marine environment, Alaska and Siberia and Lord know where?

And simply cannot be contemplated!

But then what would you expect of an activist like Pilger, he was completely content when Russia annexed the Crimea, and ostensibly to seize her oil and gas reserves?

I'd sooner split the royalties we earn from our new horizon prospect, right down the middle, rather than create a precedent that can change pre existing international boundaries!
Rhrosty.
Posted by Rhrosty, Monday, 29 February 2016 10:39:17 AM
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@Rhrosty. You obviously do not like John Pilger, but that should not be an excuse for coming up with your own set of "facts" to justify your position.

One simple fact you overlook. When there is a stretch of water between two nations, as with the Timor Sea between Australia and East Timor, international law requires that the boundary be drawn at the median point between the two nations. Your blather about continental shelves etc is pure nonsense.

Fact 2. The East Timor cabinet room was bugged on the orders of Alexander Downer. He later became a director of Woodside Petroleum that benefited from the oil and gas exploitation contracts.

Fact 3. Australia simply refused to negotiate under the terms of the UNCLOS and has throughout bullied East Timor.

Fact 4. Australia has a very poor record in its dealings with East Timor's position, including turning a blind eye to Suharto's murderous regime and its "cleansing" of Timorese dissidents.

Not for the first (and no doubt last) time Australia has adopted positions that disregard its obligations under international law, the attack on Syria merely being the latest in a long line.

If you were less obsessed in blaming Putin for all the ills of the world you might like to actually learn the facts regarding Crimea as well, but clearly for you opinions and prejudices trump facts every time.
Posted by James O'Neill, Monday, 29 February 2016 12:46:07 PM
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Someone who tries to justify the annexation of Ukraine's sovereign territory, by the biggest bully on the block, is obviously a troll.

An existing international border is part of a sovereign nation, and can't be shifted because one party doesn't like where it sits, or coverts the mineral resources!

As I've already said, I'd rather share the disputed resources than create a precedent by allowing some form of moral blackmail to be used to lever a blackmailed deal.

And blackmail a sure way to ensure little East Timor can look after its own defense interests in the future.

I don't know why a decidedly dumb Downer did what he did, save he is a conservative, and like most modern power hungry conservatives, I believe, more interested in maximizing the money and winning rather than natural justice?

And the leaked secret letters, given they are authenticated, haven't helped! And the reason they were leaked/created?

And then the, ever so slimy leakier has the temerity to condemn the Australian government for failing to help him pervert the course of justice!

If natural justice is served by sharing a resource found on our side of a preexisting international border, then I'd happily share, with and old friend and ally, rather than concede an inch of ground.

Everywhere you look there is often a natural geological feature that defines a border, the Rio Grande, Mexico and the US. Alaska and Siberia, the Continental shelves of both countries? The Great lakes and Niagara falls, the US and Canada.

We just don't need a johnny come lately,(St Petersburg troll?) telling anyone that avery long standing international border is in the wrong place.

And simply because there is a newly discovered mineral resource there?

Well we can chose to play hardball if the other side tries to shift an established border, and just refuse to settle until hell freezes over, and in so doing not concede any of the mineral wealth or royalties!

As they say in the classics, 50% of something is a whole lot better than 100% of nothing!
Posted by Rhrosty, Monday, 29 February 2016 5:22:12 PM
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Suharto should be up there on the list of worst mass-murderers of the twentieth century. But he is OUR mass-murderer. Successive Australian governments fell all over themselves to cosy up to him (wearing their sexy batik shirts) as official darling of the West.

Pilger is an almost lone voice in exposing his crimes. So complete has been the whitewashing of his evil regime that even many Indonesians, whose relatives were exterminated for the crime of being left-wing, feel an ongoing shame. And the voices of the East Timorese, whose relatives suffered the same fate, are rarely listened to.
Posted by Killarney, Tuesday, 1 March 2016 1:12:18 AM
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Rhrosty

'Someone who tries to justify the annexation of Ukraine's sovereign territory, by the biggest bully on the block, is obviously a troll.'

Rubbish. Well over 90% of the Crimean population voted in a referendum to return to the Russian federation. Even though some of the population boycotted the referendum, their numbers were miniscule.

A referendum with a result as overwhelming as this, in a nation that suited Western interests, would have been hailed as a great victory for democracy
Posted by Killarney, Tuesday, 1 March 2016 1:26:30 AM
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@Rhrosty. For someone who is so clueless about international law, it certainly doesn't stop you venturing forth with what can only be described as bizarre positions.

I agree with Killarney. Crimea had historically been part of Russia. It was "given" to Ukraine by Khrushchev in 1954 at a time when Ukraine was part of the USSR. The Crimeans were not consulted about their reallocation to another country.

Killarney is right about the referendum. It is only ignoramuses that keep using terms such as "annexation." I would only add one further point. The UN Charter (which Australia helped draft as you know) guarantees the right to self-determination. The Crimeans voted overwhelmingly to secede from Ukraine. They were entitled in law to do so. They then voted, separately, to rejoin the Russian federation.

You ought to know that American/Ukrainian rage over that development was all about the US eyeing the Russian naval base at Sevastopol. That and the intention to cut off Russian gas to Europe that mostly at that stage went through Ukraine, was what the coup was all about.

Take your blinkers off and see the world for what it really is.
Posted by James O'Neill, Tuesday, 1 March 2016 1:54:08 PM
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I should have added to the above post that Australia supported Kosovo's wish to secede from Serbia, and supported the US bombing of Serbia to discourage the Serbs wanting to hang onto Kosovo. That Australian stance was justified in terms of the UN Charter provisions I alluded to above. It is typical of the rank hypocrisy of much of Australian foreign policy that they support one region, but condemn another for doing exactly the same thing.
Posted by James O'Neill, Tuesday, 1 March 2016 1:57:03 PM
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If even half of what Pilger says is true, it is a very disturbing piece.

Looking at the Americans, their zeal for carrying guns, their often crazed politicians, and their interference in countries that seem even mildly left-wing (Chile and so on)- I'm not confident that the US is far-sighted or understanding of the way Asian countries function.

Again- a worrying and disturbing article. Bravo.

I wish our politicians would take notice of it. And I wish the media would stop feeding us slop about celebrities and expose some of these events.
Posted by Waverley, Monday, 7 March 2016 9:25:49 AM
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