Craig,

You're still making the mistake of thinking that Muslims are sheep, either getting herded hither and thither by evil imperialists, or, shaken from a state of rustic bliss, reacting to unwarranted imperialist intrusion. No, as intelligent people, they develop their own dynamics and have done since Muhammad.

When Colonel Lugard rocked up in Northern Nigeria in the 1890s, he found a raging Islamist struggle going on, with at least three Islamist factions contending, including the early forms of the Sufi groups within the Senussi who believed the Messiah was yet to come, this time to be born from a man.

Of curse, factionalism within Islam goes back to the Sunni-Shi'ite split, and, inter alia, the break-up of Muslim Spain into different Caliphates. We shouldn't be surprised, since the difficulties of communication, transport, language differences etc. across the vast Islamic world were bound to throw up a multitude of interpretations (and perhaps the mistranslations) of the Koran and hadiths. It's not as if there has been only one form of Islam, ever, only to be fractured by Western imperialism, especially by the US.

Joe

Joe, I'd love to continue this discussion, but in order for that to be a worthwhile exercise you will need to work out how to tell the difference between your own fevered imaginings and what I write. In the absence of that, all you have is political posturing. Of course, that might make you happy, but let's face it, the people behind IS are so much better at that sort of thing than you are.

Craig,

[I'm losing a post over this, I hope it's worth it]

Wow, you really are up yourself, aren't you ? How do you mean, 'fevered imaginings' ? What have I imagined ? Do you find history incomprehensible, is that the problem ?

Don't drop out just yet ! It gets better in second year :)

As for that crack: ' ..... the people behind IS are so much better at that sort of thing than you are.'

That's so hurtful :(

Joe

(Continued …The site would not permit this post earlier!)

A short-history of the image of Muhammad in the West – 2 of 2

• “The first fairly positive biography of Muhammad NOT BASED ON Christian “ideology” of the medieval period was Boulainvilliers’s La Vie de Mahomet (“The Life of Muhammad”), published in London in 1730”

• “In 1742 Voltaire’s tragedy La Fanatisme; ou, Mohamet le prophète (“Fanaticism; or, Muhammad the Prophet”) was performed in Paris, and Goethe translated it into German in 1799. This most revered of German writers was deeply attracted to Islam and planned to write a drama on this theme but completed only the famous poem Mahomets-Gesang (“Mahomet’s Singing”).”

• “At the same time (19th Century), Thomas Carlyle broke new ground in On Heroes, in which he provided a positive evaluation of the Prophet.”

• (I repeat here famous words of Thomas Carlyle: “The lies which well-meaning zeal has heaped around this man (Muhammad) are so disgraceful to ourselves only .. A silent great soul, one of that who cannot but be earnest”)

• And then (finally) came the time “when Western Orientalism was TURNING TO BIOGRAPHIES ABOUT MUHAMMAD BASED ON MODERN HISTORICAL AND ANALYTIC METHODS.”

And this dawn of “modern historical and analytical methods” have enabled truth to seep back to view for a common western through the centuries-old barriers of misinformation erected around Muhammad by the medieval mindset.

This age of reason has brought facts to the daylight. Countless researchers with upright minds tell you today that Muhammad was NOT a bit like anything the medieval literature wants you to believe.

Today, it is impossible for a historian to say things about Muhammad, that you say Kactuz, and still be able to retain his/her credibility.

The lunatic fringe is an exception.

This fringe has always existed in human societies and will continue to exist.

However, the inevitable destination for the names in this fringe, scholars on leaders, is the dust bin of the history.

Message for you Kactuz, from all this: Please revisit your knowledge-base.

"Wow, you really are up yourself, aren't you ?"

I thought not, Joe. He reminds me more of a guy so focused on his own self-esteem that .... http://youtu.be/4g-9Y5X-fGQ

Craig. Stick to threads where you can spout unfalsifiable P&W to your heart's content (i.e. faith-based threads) and leave threads like this, where beliefs are being vigorously tested, to we grown-ups. Your vitriol is purposeless.

NC, I read what you write and appreciate your attempt to dispute the violent messages in your holy books. It would be wonderful to think that on Islamic blogs you, and McAdam, are carrying on the same argument to counter the basis in faith held by Islamicists for their violent actions.

A happy New Year to all

and

Best Wishes from NC