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The Forum > Article Comments > We should get used to paying more for gas > Comments

We should get used to paying more for gas : Comments

By Benjamin O'Sullivan, published 6/12/2013

Australia is poised to become a major player in the global liquefied natural gas (LNG) market and domestic gas users are worried that the party will be at their expense.

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Benjamin well done with this missive. Here is another idea in the same vein. Why don't we ensure that we profit from you and put a special tax on your life earnings, not just HECS, an added amount and refuse you a passport?
Mate we export gas at silly prices and then charge the consumer a lot more! What about industry? So we rip off the consumer every which way and send jobs off shore.
Gee and you wonder why people like me would start ripping the proverbial out of Australia's education budget. Lets replace Benjy with an Indian or Chinese student who will apply themselves better.
How do you like those apples Ben?
Posted by JBowyer, Friday, 6 December 2013 7:24:42 AM
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...The usual socially destructive argument from the Capitalists....Anyone for crumbs?
Posted by diver dan, Friday, 6 December 2013 7:56:32 AM
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Ah yes - the invisible hand of "efficient markets".
And the tyranny of "free" World Trade agreements.
Let them eat cake!

Apart from the many countries still being exploited under the yoke of old style colonialism and imperialism (Nigeria for instance -think Shell)would any other "advanced" country tolerate or even allow such a situation.
Posted by Daffy Duck, Friday, 6 December 2013 8:04:38 AM
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Yes, JBower this:

"Mate we export gas at silly prices and then charge the consumer a lot more! What about industry? So we rip off the consumer every which way and send jobs off shore."

Sadly it is so true.

The greed of the corporation in the persuit of profit knows no bounds. But what is the solution? Nationalisation of the assets where the government ( read tax payer ) foots the bill? Fix the domestic prices? I do not know.

For the domestic consumer the best strategy is not to use gas at all. The most energy efficient (7 star) houses do not use gas but highly efficient electric devices and alternate energy. The prevailing wisdom for new builds is not to use gas in the first place. We are in a state of transition where large numbers of people use gas but as time progresses there will be a transition away from the use of gas to the highly efficient electric appliances and the use of local solar energy. Remember that the energy retailers will start the same bleeding heart arguments about gas infrastructure to bump up the gas prices even further. Remember that if one has gas and electric energy supplies one is paying for two lots of infrastructure. Does one really need two types of energy at home?

As for industry disadvantaged by very high gas rices - No easy solutions.
Posted by Kilmouski, Friday, 6 December 2013 8:52:26 AM
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Adding to my last post.

Gas delivered to the home will be a very expensive commodity but at least there is an alternative in electric energy where, barring all the political BS, the consumer will have slightly more control of their domestic energy supply.
Posted by Kilmouski, Friday, 6 December 2013 9:02:26 AM
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Benjamin, are you sure there is no market failure?

The capital cost of the infrastructure needed to process, transport and degasify LNG is a huge barrier to entry. If Asian markets are indeed significantly and sustainably more profitable than Australian ones, that is surely evidence of market power leading to monopoly profit. If producers are unwilling to supply domestic markets at prices that would deliver “normal” profits, that is also evidence of market failure.

I also think you are wrong to say the WTO rules on export quotas would prohibit gas reservation. Every country I can think of with significant gas reserves takes some measure to ensure domestic markets are not overlooked – even the USA requires export permits for sales to many countries.

I’m normally at the dry end of the economic spectrum, but on this issue I’m not sure the free market is welfare-optimising.
Posted by Rhian, Friday, 6 December 2013 2:39:05 PM
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Interesting preposition Ben. As the dollar is now down to approx 90 cents to the USD.
When the AUD was around $1.10 against the USD petrol soared to $154.00 a ltr.
The AUD is down to 90cents approx, we are paying $1.54.
Ridiculous!
Posted by very curious, Friday, 6 December 2013 4:23:06 PM
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In calculating future fuel prices, best include Mr Abbott's direct action 'tax', or 'direct pricing' or whatever it will be called.
Posted by JF Aus, Friday, 6 December 2013 5:21:13 PM
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I call this the 'let them eat cake' argument.

Ben, if you were ever restricted to a low income with no hope of betterment in life, you would understand.
Posted by dane, Saturday, 7 December 2013 2:32:43 AM
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'Australian should get used to paying more for gas'
So why were they aloud to cell off our gass to oversees markets at bargun basement prizes?
Posted by KarlX, Saturday, 7 December 2013 5:51:00 AM
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Benjamen totally missed not just the point but the subject as well.
It is not about reserving gas for Australian domestic users but about
reserving all the gas for transport as well.

Perhaps he does not realise that ALL our oil refineries are being closed.
Shell in Sydney closed a couple of years ago.
Shell in Geelong is to be closed unless a buyer is found.
Caltex in Sydney closes next year.
Brisbane closes in two years.

Why is this being done ?
Because Australian oil production has fallen to 45% of what we use.
Australian oil production is declining at 4% a year.
When all the refineries are closed we will import 100% of our petrol & diesel.

They cannot compete against the large refineries in Singapore.
Australia will be at risk of petrol & diesel starvation in the event
of major trouble in the middle east. That would would lead very
quickly to food starvation in Australia.
Think I am joking ?
It took just three days of a truck driver strike in the UK for women
to be fighting in the super market aisles over the last cans of food.
Don't think the US Navy will come to the rescue, they have no control
over opening the Straits of Hormuz or other choke points.
The movement of ships is at the OK of insurance companies.

WE need to reserve the gas for use in trucks and cars.
That demand would be so large that there would be no room for export.
We have to assume that the change to the use of gas in trucks and cars
would be permanent.

It seems that Uni students as well as politicians have myoptic views on energy.
Posted by Bazz, Sunday, 8 December 2013 12:26:14 PM
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Spot on there, Bazz.
Posted by JF Aus, Sunday, 8 December 2013 8:02:39 PM
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