Employees of the police force, the diplomatic service, the intelligence agencies, the military and other instruments of government control and power serve the violent purposes of the state other than those agreed on by the polity. Actually clear-headed people realise this. Those who are willing to accept this accept government employment in those areas. Those who are not willing to accept this do not seek or accept those jobs.

If government would make clear it will not tolerate that type of activity, will bring to account those who practice such activities and protect those who expose such activities such activities will be minimised. That is not going to happen.

Aware people of conscience therefore avoid service in the police force, the diplomatic service, the intelligence agencies, the military and other instruments of government control and power serve the violent purposes of the state other than those agreed on by the polity.

Therefore those who fill those ranks will consist of people who are aware of what they are getting into and accept it, people who were not aware but find it difficult to do anything about it when they become aware and the few like Manning, Snowden and Ellsberg who expose the crimes when they become aware of them.

david f,
we generalise those people by calling them public servants & bureaucrats who got into these jobs & positions because they have a degree such as a BA.

It can be amusing and instructive to read articles from fringe group thinkers like Robert Burrows, who have an entirely different logic, and an entirely different sense of proportion, to normal people. Central to Robert's logic, is that the world is populated and divided by far seeing Internationalists like himself, and Nationalists, of which the inhabitants of the USA are the most infamous incorrigibles.

Seen through the distorting prism of this extraordinary ideology, a new logic can emerge. People like Bradley Manning and Edward Snowden then become patriots to the cause of Internationalism, while they remain just contemptible traitors to the overwhelming majority of people who reject their Internationalist convictions and believe that a person should be loyal to their own.

Warming to his theme, Robert then labels everyone on planet Earth who does not conform to his fringe group logic as "traitors and collaborators". He really knows how to win friends and influence people. After labelling the people he does not like, (ie, most of the human race) he then prejudges them with no less than ten negative stereotypes of his own invention.

One of Robert's more potty stereotypes, is that "traitors and collaborators" are the sort of people who approve of violence. The implication being, that Internationalists like himself would never stoop to such a thing. Sorry Robert, the world has already come across Socialist "Internationalist" societies before, and these societies have piled the bodies up in the killing fields, and opened Gulags everywhere in their quest for non violence.

It was the USA which led the world in opposing this socialist internationalist madness, which is why you and your little mates will never forgive the USA. You Socialists had your chance and you blew it. I can understand how resentful you are that the yanks beat you, but spare me the socialist BS. Most people today have minds that are totally inoculated to Socialist social theory and its associated inverted logic.

One definition of "insanity" is, "repeating failure, over and over again.

LEGO in his comments seems to support fascism. We have illegal wars by the imperialist West and he sees people like Bradley Manning and Snowden as being traitors to their Govt.

LEGO see http://www.ae911truth.org/ and explain to me how 3 towers on 911 came down at nearly free fall speeds which defy the laws of physics. They were all controlled demolition. Who put the explosives in the towers?

Who put the explosives in the towers?
Arjay,
what I find even more intriguing is that the herd of pink elephants flying alongside did no show on the radar.

Individual>> what I find even more intriguing is that the herd of pink elephants flying alongside did no show on the radar.<<

Some FACTS about 911 Indy:

Fire has never — prior to or after 9/11 — caused any other steel frame building to collapse.

WTC Building 7 located one block from the Twin Towers was not hit by any plane, but collapsed.

Leslie Robertson, WTC structural engineer said “The towers were built to withstand a Boeing jet(s). “I designed it for a 707 to hit it, it could sustain multiple impacts of jetliners”, “like a pencil puncturing screen netting.”

Whenever contact is lost with any airplane, fighter jets routinely take to the air to investigate. This commonly occurs about 100 times per year in well under 20 minutes. But on 9/11 nearly two hours passed without any interception.

Cheney admits to giving the order to shoot down Flight 93, “shot down the plane over Pennsylvania.” Chris Konicki a Fox News photographer said from the scene of the shoot down “Nothing that you could distinguish that a plane had crashed there, just a hole in the ground. Coroner Wallace Miller reported, “not a drop of blood. Mayor Ernie Stull said “there was no plane.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aobIBU1wJfY

TBC

The Secret Service broke established protocols by allowing President Bush to remain in a well-publicized classroom "photo op" long after it was known that the U.S. was under attack and he might well have been a target.

The Bush administration resisted the formation of the 9/11 Commission for 441 days. Similar investigations, such as those for Pearl Harbor, the JFK assassination, and the space shuttle disasters, all started in about one week.

Firefighters and witness testimony to BOMBS/EXPLOSIONS were ignored by the 9/11 Commission Report. 9/11 Commission Report bars 503 1st responder eyewitnesses. ‘Firefighters on the scene ‘Barry Jennings’ and ‘William Rodriguez’. Said on the day, “there were explosions in the lobby and sub levels”,

6 out of the 10 of the 9/11 Commissioners believe the 9/11 Commission report was “Setup to fail” Co-Chairs Hamilton and Kean stated, “It was a 30 year conspiracy.” Commissioner ‘Max Cleland’ stated “The Whitehouse has played cover up,” before he resigned.

Individual>> Who put the explosives in the towers?
Arjay,<<

Marvin Bush was director of Stratasec (Securacom, ‘KuAm’) which was in charge of security of the WTC, United Airlines and Dulles International Airport. All three were breached on 9/11.

Indy you believe it if you like, but it stinks, and if you do not smell it be carefull around gas sport.

“I designed it for a 707 to hit it, it could sustain multiple impacts of jetliners”, “like a pencil puncturing screen netting.”
sonofgloin,
Of course the engineer would say that, especially one that doesn't think strong wings full of fuel are of any consequence. As for fire never having been the cause of a steel building collapse, well the twin towers were the first. Conspiracy theories are entertaining but some people take it to extraordinary lengths.

Thank you, thank you, Arjay and Sonofogloin. Your peculiar mindsets and mind boggling conspiracy theories are the best tool I have for convincing border line trendies that the anti everything philosophy is lunacy.

Please keep it up as it is helping me immensely.

In answer to your question about who put the explosives in the twin towers, well, it must have been the Joos or the Martians, right?

Thank you again, and please, think up some stupidities to support your premises.

Lego>> Thank you again, and please, think up some stupidities to support your premises.<<

Yes Lego, you are welcome sport, I listed the "stupidiities" in my post to Indy.

There are a load “stupidities” including the names of 9/11 Commissioners....I expect that they jumped the gun when voicing their reservations that the Bush Administration was not running an honest game.

Just while I am here, did you apply for the position of oracle to the “border line trendies”, or did they seek out your intellect?

Hi Sonofgloin

Nah, I like deprograming trendies as a hobby. I got so sick and tired of people like you always putting the boot into my country, my people, and my allies, that I decided to shoot back. And you know what? I am really heartened by what a poor response that people like you can put up.

I honestly can not understand why people such as yourself hate the very society that you choose to live in. If western civilisation is so horrible, could you please go and live with your African, South American or Muslim friends? And good riddance.

Lego>> I got so sick and tired of people like you always putting the boot into my country,<<

Your country sport….that statement alone exhibits the naivety of a simple soul. We are not an island any more.

We no longer manufacture to any extent here because of “trade agreements” brokered without consultation with us in the Northern Hemisphere.

Our power costs have risen by 70% over the past six years because of environmental mandates from the Northern Hemisphere.

Our borders are porous because of mandates from the Northern Hemisphere.

Our primary age kids came last in literacy of all the English speaking nations because of PC mandates from the Northern Hemisphere.

Nah this country is no longer “ours,” we don’t have a sovereign nation sport we have a raft of UN driven mandates and “free” trade agreements that direct our future.

So my nationalistic firebrand, whatever tune you are dancing to, it did not originate in Australia. There is nothing more pitiful than a follower who has not got a clue who is setting their dance card.

If western civilisation is so horrible, could you please go and live with your African, South American or Muslim friends? And good riddance.
LEGO,
Agree but, there's a big but, although our society is still the more favourable hence they all aspire to our lifestyle, there are far too many now in our society who are through sheer stupidity are jeopardising our way of life. This stupidity evolved from too much pointless education for those who haven't the intelligence to use that education. Then there are those who are so stupid they want to just give everything to those who want to trample us into the ground. Then there those stupid who are too stupid to see how stupid they are & call evryone else stupid. I say give these people some physical work to do in a National service & they'll soon acquire some appreciation of their by then hopefully former stupidity.

To Sonofogloin

Our power costs have risen, because of some stupid Socialist idea that "rich" nations should subsidise "poor" nations by the imposition of a "carbon tax". And it was our stupid Labor Government under Rudd the Dudd, who was partially elected by the Chinese vote, who enthusiastically embraced it. Pick up yesterday's paper and there is Rudd standing beside Penny Wong, letting every Chinese citizen living in Australia who votes in our elections know that Rudd is China's man.

Our border's are porous because Labor wants the ethnic vote, especially the Arab and Muslim vote. The principle is simple. Allow unassimilatable people who will never fit in, and who will be a social problem dependent on welfare forever, to migrate into Australia and become your new electorate. This has great benefit to your other electorate, (the public service) who's empires can expand by the need to fix the avoidable social problems which these new arrivals create. More Muslims means more Labor voters, more police, more prison warders, Centrelink staff, and social workers.

Our children are lagging because one of the cornerstones of the Labor Party are the Socialist Teacher's Unions, full of lousy teachers who have the idea that children must never compete with each other. Preventing children from competing means that they will not have to explain why, if all races are equal, the Asians always come first, the whites second, and the Pacific Islanders, Muslims, aborigines and African blacks a long way last.