The referendum is not an attack on artificial tribalism(aka federalism). I'll be voting Yes with a yawn though concerned about cossetting local councils dominated by self-serving developers and estate agents. If it were really a move to end tribalism I'd be voting Yes with enthusiasm and urging others to do likewise, for the reasons advanced by Foyle and Rhrosty and Lego plus some in addition.

Australia, a small country, is saddled with nine governments. Every Australian citizen has two governments chipping away at his or her liberty. For example all young Australian men stood to be conscripted by the national government into America's colonial war in Vietnam while at the same time West Australians and Tasmanians were also denied freedom of assembly, and Queenslanders were subjected to a raft of repressive state laws. Currently Victorians are subject to blasphemy laws (dressed up as anti-vilification) to protect Islam but not the infidels, apostates and blasphemers the Moslem "holy books" vilify and urge followers to behead.

Two governments denying the one citizen liberty are a double whammy, as neither government has power to restore the liberties the other government steals.

Anything that can rid us of all but one government is well worth supporting.

There is no way I'd vote for any constitutional recognition of local government. The referendum proposal may be dressed up as a funding need but in reality it would give local governments the constitutional legitimacy they have craved for decades. As it stands councils are collecting an illegal tax, rates based on property value, and should they be recognised in the constitution that illegality would likely be struck down.

When the constitution was created the founding fathers, arguably, left out local government as they did not want to authorise three tiers of government in Australia. Local councils have slowly extended their tentacles of influence and interference further into our lives and we have sat back and let them. Now is the time to say no more...get back in your (padded) boxes local governments. We don't want you in our lives and collecting illegal taxes and fines. Keep to rubbish collection and road maintenance

Vote NO to more power for local governments!

Minotaur, surely we should always be striving to bring the law and accepted practice into line. Local government and the Constitution have been out of whack forever… which just makes a mockery of the Constitution.

So if we are going to value our Constitution, and the rule of law in general, then we need to recognise local government within it.

The only other options are;

to continue to have one thing enshrined in law and something entirely different happening in practice or

we eliminate local government by rebranding every local government as a state government branch… which I guess could be done without significantly affecting the functionality of the current setup.

As far as giving local government, or state or federal government, more power; it is a two-way street – it can have advantages and disadvantages. It definitely wouldn’t simply be all bad, as you are implying.

So vote YES, which will at give least some sort of formal recognition to local government in the Constitution.

You must be kidding Ludwig. Voting yes would be akin to voting for a Pandora's Box inside a Trojan horse. I believe that lack of constitutional recognition makes a mockery of the legitimacy of local government, not the other way around. As Australian citizens we are grossly over-governed and part of that is attributable to the creation of local governments. We should be getting rid of them; not giving them more authority!

I'll be voting NO!

<< I believe that lack of constitutional recognition makes a mockery of the legitimacy of local government… >>

Yes.

But the converse is just as true. You can’t have one without the other – the accepted legal status of local government and of its power to charge rates, impose fines, etc, makes a mockery of the Constitution.

So Minotaur, what would you do about this?

Would you leave it as it is, insert formal recognition of local government in the Constitution, which apparently can only happen by way of a referendum, change the definition of local government so that it is formally part of state government, or abolish local governments outright?

<< Voting yes would be akin to voting for a Pandora's Box inside a Trojan horse. >>

I can’t see it. Can you substantiate this claim?

<< …we are grossly over-governed… >>

I strongly disagree. We are inefficiently governed. We actually need considerably stronger governance in many areas.

It would appear to me, Ludwig, that as it is being presented the referendum question is a covert means of giving local government the constitutional recognition they have been desperate for. Once included in the Constitution they could then say they have the legal authority to impose taxes or create laws. They could also say they have the authority to stand alone from state government jurisdiction, which is what created them in the first place. If you believe the argument that inclusion is necessary for funding purposes then you may also believe the government when it says asylum seekers are primarily economic refugees or that there will be no carbon tax.

I agree that we are inefficiently governed but surely part of the inefficiency comes from being over-governed? Here in Tasmania we have 29 (used to be 56) local councils for a population of 500 000. On top of that there are 25 MPs, 16 legislative councillor's, 6 senators and 5 federal reps. Surely a prime example of over-governance?

Personally I would like to see local governments wiped from the political landscape. As it stands many councils leave the day to day running of municipality to a team of professionals with a manager or CEO at the top. Get rid of the wannabe political players and simply keep the management teams who would ultimately report to the state government. After a few mergers to increase efficiencies of course.