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The Forum > Article Comments > Terrorism - Obama statement seriously deficient > Comments

Terrorism - Obama statement seriously deficient : Comments

By Des Moore, published 27/5/2013

Karl Rove, is reported as claiming that Obama was 'complicit in the Benghazi lie' and as pointing out that he (Obama) knew of the attack on the consulate.

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As for "the Benghazi lie", what Benghazi lie? Des Moore's neocon mates cut funding Obama sought for US embassies’ security, leaving them vulnerable. PNAC freaks in the USA are salivating for removal of Obama to open the way for perpetual war, plundering public wealth and stripping constitutional protection of human rights. Hence the orchestrated attacks.
Posted by EmperorJulian, Monday, 27 May 2013 4:26:24 PM
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This screed of twaddle is the work of someone who is able to write a responsible report? ??

And I quote:

"The reality, which Prime Minister Cameron and Lord Mayor Johnson seem determined to ignore for fear of scaring the community, is that a considerable proportion of British Muslims are either sympathetic to violent action by extremists or prepared to play a role in it."

Yeah? Says who?

Generalising about Moslems in the UK (do you live there now?) and basing your gross generalisations on reportage about grotesque atrocities carried out by criminals who justify their actions through a warped, sectarian view? Irresponsible and arguably vilifying, I would say.

Why not go after Christianity, with the argument that sectarian violence was responsible for The Troubles in Ireland? Why not point out all the murderers and paedophiles who identify as Christians, and find a few biblical quotes from the St James version of the old and new testaments to back up a line of twaddle about the evil done and about to be done by Christians?

Or do you have a thing about Muslims? I'll bet you do.

Visit a mosque, I say. See if the people there are all murmering and muttering maniacs. My guess is that you will find ordinary Australians who want the same things for their families as you want for your family: peace and prosperity, and a fair go.

At least, I assume that's what you want for your family.
Posted by Sir Vivor, Monday, 27 May 2013 10:48:48 PM
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The fundamental error that you are committing, my dear Rhian, is equating Christianity with Islam.

Your premise appears to be, that violent extremists exist in all religions and belief systems, and that such extremists are held in contempt by the "moderates".

First. Where are the "moderate" Muslims who do not believe in Sharia Law? The inequality of women to males? Or who are not violently anti Semitic? And when did these "moderate Muslims" start believing in the separation of church and state? If they believe in anything which fundamentally contradicts the will of Allah as written in the Koran, then they are not Muslims.

Second, Christianity and Islam today have two separate concepts in regards to anybody who openly condones violence to promote his religion. A Christian who advocated violence to spread Christianity would be considered by almost all Christians to be a dangerous nut case. But Muhammad has commanded that the Jihadis who spread Islam by the sword are the finest Muslims around, who will get 72 panting virgins after they are dead, and will get met at the gates of paradise by Allah Himself.

Christian "extremists" are committed pacifists like the Amish or the Quakers, because Christianity was originally a pacifist religion created by a Jewish hippie. Muslim "extremists" are not pacifists, because Islam is a warriors religion created by a warlord.

It is true that most Christians do not accept the extreme pacifism as preached by Christ, but they can't be too contemptuous of the ones who do. Likewise, it is true that most Muslims do not accept that pagans should have their throats cut ("smite them about their necks") or that Islam should "fight the unbelievers who are near to them". But since Allah has commanded that the people who do these things are the finest Muslims there are, they can't denigrate them either, or they would be opposing the will of God.
Posted by LEGO, Tuesday, 28 May 2013 7:06:29 AM
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Sir Vivor

I do not necessarily equate Christianity and Islam, but I do believe most religions and many political ideologies seem capable of throwing up extremists willing to do violence in their name.

The moderate Muslims I know believe in gender equality and are not violently anti-semitic. They support Sharia law, which is a complex web of legal precepts and customs, not the hand-lopping barbarity that it is misrepresented as.

“If they believe in anything which fundamentally contradicts the will of Allah as written in the Koran, then they are not Muslims”. Yes, and nor should Christians believe anything that fundamentally contradicts the will of God. Of course, working out what that is can be complex, and (non-fundamentalist) Christians do not treat the bible as a hard-and-fast rule book. But whenever Christians affirm that “Jesus is Lord” - which we are called to do quite often, and is a fundamental premise of our beliefs – then we are making a statement that there is a higher authority than the Prime Minister or the electorate to which we are ultimately accountable.

Christian extremists can include Quakers and Amish, but also crusaders, pogrom initiators, inquisitors and imperialists who destroy other people's cultures to save their souls. I would argue these are not true to Christian beliefs, but nor are the butchers of Woolwich true to Islam.
Posted by Rhian, Tuesday, 28 May 2013 11:37:12 AM
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My apologies, the previous post should be addressed to LEGO, not Sir Vivor
Posted by Rhian, Tuesday, 28 May 2013 12:50:38 PM
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No Worries, Rhian,

you may enjoy reading this:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/may/25/andrew-sullivan-distortion-terrorism-woolwich

Para about halfway through:

"Labeling the violent acts of those Muslim Others as "terrorism" - but never our own - is a key weapon used to propagate this worldview. The same is true of the tactic that depicts their violence against us as senseless, primitive, savage and without rational cause, while glorifying our own violence against them as noble, high-minded, benevolent and civilized (we slaughter them with shiny, high-tech drones, cluster bombs, jet fighters and cruise missiles, while they use meat cleavers and razor blades). These are the core propagandistic premises used to sustain the central narrative on which the War on Terror has depended from the start (and, by the way, have been the core premises of imperialism for centuries)."
Posted by Sir Vivor, Tuesday, 28 May 2013 9:00:48 PM
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