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Class sizes and the dead hand of history : Comments
By Dean Ashenden, published 1/3/2013Smaller class sizes are good, but other measures are better, and cost far less.
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Posted by Hasbeen, Saturday, 2 March 2013 10:25:22 AM
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One new area which I'm sure you'd approve of nannabev, is the in school apprenticeship scheme.
It is going quite well in our large near Brisbane country high. The most difficult problem for us is lack of public transport to many of the areas where we can find companies willing to take part. Not only does it give a number of kids, who have no intention of undertaking academic courses an outlet & an interest one full day a week, it gives them a small income to boot. Even better, as those taking part are usually the more committed, they do well in the workplace. With some experience & having shown a willingness to work, most of the kids have a job to go to immediately on finishing school. My wife ran the scheme for our P&C for some years, & we had over 50 kids involved some years. It has since been run by the professional career advisors in the school who are not finding the same number of employers willing to take kids, [perhaps they won't beg on behalf of the kids], but the kids still love it, & it is still advantaging many. Posted by Hasbeen, Saturday, 2 March 2013 7:54:17 PM
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Yes Hasbeen , I am aware and do heartily approve of these opportunities available now, but there was about 15 years lag time in which we 'lost' many young folk Australia wide. I still feel "holding" frustrated, non academic kids in school until they are 17-18( and then they have to be paid near to work experienced adult wages ) contributes heavily to the abysmal current youth unemployment figures.
So many never have the good feeling and confidence boost of having a real job for a real period of time with regular income, and there is a reality that the hardest time be a successful job applicant is when unemployed ( and much harder when the person has no real experience of a workplace). It is a terrible gamble for the employer to take on these young people. Posted by nannabev, Sunday, 3 March 2013 8:45:18 AM
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Arguments over class sizes seem about as relevant today as discussing what paper size to use for electronic textbooks. Research shows that class size is not a significant factor in student results. More importantly, as learning moves from the classroom to on-line, "class size" becomes less meaningful. Teaching is moving on-line, faster at higher levels (fastest at universities), but is moving at all levels. We need to discover the best way to blend face-to-face student interactions, especially for learning social skills and e-learning. I suspect there will still be a need for small classes and a "home room" for students, but these will mostly be virtual and more fluid.
See: 1. "A Green Computing Professional Education Course Online" from my paper at the 7th International Conference on Computer Science & Education (ICCSE 2012): http://www.tomw.net.au/technology/it/green_computing_professional/ 2. On-line Professional Education For Australian Research-Intensive Universities in the Asian Century: http://blog.tomw.net.au/2012/11/on-line-professional-education-for.html 3. "Combining Synchronous and Asynchronous Learning Techniques" for the 8th International Conference on Computer Science & Education (ICCSE), Colombo, Sri Lanka, April 2013: http://blog.tomw.net.au/2013/01/combining-synchronous-and-asynchronous.html Posted by tomw, Monday, 4 March 2013 10:24:20 AM
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In the 1960s the Finns realised that the products of their education system were of much lower quality in literacy and numeracy than would be expected for a first-world nation. This state of affairs was turned around mainly by raising the standards required of teachers. In particular, only those in the top ten percent of academic achievers at high school could end up as teachers. Today Finland consistently rates at or near the top in measures of education performance. Over the same period Australia has followed a policy of lowering standards across the board at universities and then reacts with surprise at the level of mediocrity we now encounter.
When asked: Do you believe that all children should be given an equal opportunity for a good education? Most people including all politicians answer “Yes”. When asked: Do you believe that you should strive to give your child an educational advantage over others? Many people answer “Yes” by their actions. When asked: Do you think the Government should provide funds so that your child can get this advantage over others? A large portion of the population answers “Of course.” If these are our cultural attitudes how can we expect to raise educational standards for all our children? Money spent on education needs to be spent more wisely than it is at present. Posted by Dayton, Monday, 4 March 2013 12:48:36 PM
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Tomw the only situation where class size is not relevant is if exams are set as multiple choice questions marked by computer technology. Maybe futuristically, just a direct download installation into the brain.
Any education situation, such as in primary and early secondary school, where personal mentoring, individual guidance and marking of assessments, provision of social training and parenting, and the never ending additional demands by governments for more detailed reporting to satisfy their need for statistics, IMMEDIATELY DEMANDS A CAP ON CLASS SIZES, otherwise there will be little time to actually teach ! Posted by nannabev, Tuesday, 5 March 2013 8:49:35 AM
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Then instead of teaching something worthwhile, the teaching of the real subjects, math & science, were merely drawn out to fill the 2 extra years. Kids leaving year 12 had no more math & science, or anything else for that matter, than those previously leaving year 10.
In fact the reverse was often the case, as many less competent teachers had to be added to the workforce to stand in front of those new classes. Many of those "teachers" are still standing in front of classes today, despite having never taught anyone anything.
We now find a large requirement for remedial math in tech collages, [TAFE I believe today], so these 17 year olds can be brought up to the standard of 15 year olds of yesterday, a standard required for many trades. The huge drop out rate in for example, electrical apprenticeships, is due mostly to these lids being unable to grasp what was normal math for the intermediate certificate, due to lack of grounding.
The really astounding thing is many graduating from Uni with a BSc, particularly in things like environmental science, & many medical subjects, would be unable to undertake those apprenticeships, without a remedial math course first.