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The Forum > Article Comments > NSW Labor's diseased ethics > Comments

NSW Labor's diseased ethics : Comments

By Tony Smith, published 7/2/2013

As former ministers front an inquiry into decisions allegedly taken to favour political friends, the corruption disease seems to be confined to the NSW Labor Party.

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Tony,
It's not just NSW, the threads are starting to unravel in Victoria as well,Darebin council is in crisis again and here too the "Lebanese Element"is becoming as problematic here as the "Greek element" was in the 1990's:
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/darebin-council-could-face-sack-20121128-2aef2.html
The recently incorporated Darebin council is a good example of modern grass roots Labor in microcosm, as far as I know we'd never had a Liberal councillor until the 2012 election and many of the "independants" have been exposed as Labor ward heelers or cronies.
Posted by Jay Of Melbourne, Thursday, 7 February 2013 9:54:18 AM
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"It will be an interesting contest as luminaries of the Labor Right try to convince voters that they should reject Abbott, despite their growing affinity with his policy leanings and political style."

Yes, the absurdity of politics as a team sport with very little to distinguish on ideology.

The demise of the Labor Party started with Keating's neo-liberal agenda and the privatisation of public assets. It has become not just a party that cannot contain or eradicate it's most corrupt elements but a party that has lost it's way with devolving of power to the top. The grass roots focus is sadly missed.
Posted by pelican, Thursday, 7 February 2013 10:03:17 AM
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It's not a problem confined to NSW, but every state?
One remembers well the, [lay preacher,] B Petersen era, the white shoe brigade, the gerrymander, the state police acting as a wing of government, the secret police, the Minister for everything and the alleged brown paper bags full of money?
Corruption and cronyism seems particularly a problem of so called right wing politics?
It seems to me that right wing politics and traditional Labour, is a mix which simply does not fit!
Nor are staffers, who go straight from university into staff positions and then directly into politics, without any REAL WORLD experience!?
And politics is an instrument of recent convenience for some so called millionaire politicians, and or business failures, who use/see it as a personal vehicle to progress personal political and or commercial ambition/business salvation, rather than reform or a better deal for the less well off?
One notes, both Hawke and Keating retired as millionaires, and the average super package, [untaxed,] for politicians, is around four million?
And they talk of taxing ordinary folks super packages, if they're above a million?
In the original Westminster tradition politics was unpaid and voluntary!
And conservative politics was progressive! How things have changed!
If only the Labour party membership were means tested, we likely could have confined the corruption and cronyism, to its more traditional home, or conservative politics?
Personally, I think the only way to eliminate this problem, is simply place the incumbent last on the ballot paper, for several elections; or at least until all the dross is cleaned out of politics and the reforms we need are finally, reality.
Alternatively, we could have a policy of just two terms?
That way there'd be enough turnover to seriously limit or curtail corruption!?
Rhrosty.
Posted by Rhrosty, Thursday, 7 February 2013 12:06:14 PM
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dare I say that it is only the Christian influence in individual lives that gives any decent moral basis. No surprise that much of Labour and some of Liberal and almost all of Greens is morally bereft. I await the usual screams. No wonder so many support the porn industry, the baby killing industry and then put their self righteousness on display when visiting schools and hospital. Lance Armstrong would be a 'good ' captains pick for the current state of affairs.
Posted by runner, Thursday, 7 February 2013 1:26:36 PM
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Tony makes some valid points, especially about the narrowness of ethics defined as conforming to the rules, and inadequacy of managerialism to foster genuinely ethical behaviour.

However, I think he goes too far in implying that those policy shifts of which he disapproves are also a product of “diseased ethics”. Supporting the privatisation of the Commonwealth Bank, or telecommunications reregulation, is a world away from using an official credit card to pay prostitutes or using insider information to profit from mining developments.

In fact, recognising that people can advocate policies and sincerely believe them to be in the national interest - even if you happen to disagree with them – is one of the planks of ethical political behaviour that is increasingly lacking nowadays
Posted by Rhian, Thursday, 7 February 2013 2:52:38 PM
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Come on Rhrosty, you bring up an example of the rhorts practised by labour, all its life, & then attribute it to Old Joh, & the Nationals. What are you, a kid who doesn't know, or a conman?

I rather enjoyed the gerrymander, as it was a prime example of fool Labor tricks, coming back to bite them. It was introduced by Labor, when the farming districts were full of farm labour. Kept them in power, illegitimately for many years. Then the farms stopped using labour.

I did not appreciate old Joh, & wanted him gone, until I saw the terrible mess Goss, Beattie & Bleigh made of the state. Even so, I couldn't help smiling every time yet another Labor polly started bleating how unfair the gerrymander was.

Looks like you do your research in the wrong sites mate. You must be using one of those where the lefties rewrite history to suit their narrative.
Posted by Hasbeen, Thursday, 7 February 2013 3:42:09 PM
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Wherever there is easy money to be made, there is corruption. It goes on at every level of Government: local, State and Federally. It occurs in the Police Force, the judiciary, the MSM, even among clerics and, dare I say it, lawyers.

The problems is that greed has been elevated to iconic status. We are conditioned to envy those who have big mansions and luxury motor yachts and power. We are taught that winners are grinners and we all must do whatever it takes to join them or be classed as failures.

A world based upon greed is a sick world. Few are advantaged. The rest pay the price.

My blog has a photograph of a man being tortured as part of the CIA rendition program which Australia is a part of (click on the house symbol at the bottom of this post to check it out).

You may not be so worried about NSW corruption anymore.

There are bigger fish to fry!
Posted by David G, Thursday, 7 February 2013 6:26:37 PM
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Runner, there are plenty of shonks who are also Christians. I well remember my father attending a meeting at which one pompous gentle proclaimed himself to be a "Christian businessman" whereapon dad was heard to retort "And a rogue to boot". And he wasn't wrong either.

David
Posted by VK3AUU, Thursday, 7 February 2013 8:12:38 PM
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runner
Which of the Greens policies do you find morally bereft. I await your enlightening comments.
Posted by pelican, Thursday, 7 February 2013 11:04:37 PM
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VK3AUU,

'Runner, there are plenty of shonks who are also Christians '

no arguement with me there VK3AUU. The difference is they have a moral basis that lets them know they are shonks. Moral relativist don't hence the putried corruption that is uncovered in sport and politics where wrong is know called right and vice versa.
Posted by runner, Thursday, 7 February 2013 11:05:36 PM
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When you really look at it Labor is simply saturated with many little dictators. The only good thing is they are just that, little ! The sad thing is that they totally lack competence. If only we could somehow make them benevolent.
Posted by individual, Friday, 8 February 2013 6:35:34 AM
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runner your point is a side issue but in my experience christains are some of the best at not knowing that they are corrupt or at writing their failings off to an already fallen nature thankfully forgiven.

I think the world view you express fail to acknowledges the role human choice plays in determining which parts of a thiestic belief system are taken seriously and which are not. There are believers who treat their beliefs as a call to living a life of decency and honesty, for others those are a pretence which is useful to fool others.

On the broader topic, I think the author is using the piece to advocate for a shift to the left more than genuninely addressing ethics and values in politics or else where. I've not seen any reason to believe the left is any less susceptible to corruption than any other part of politics. There is a common human trait from the fringes to believe that the problem does not really exist amongst the tue believers (who ever they may be) and that any abberations are not really true believers. If someone on my side plays up they ar an abberation, if its someone from the other side thats typical of what you would expect.

R0bert
Posted by R0bert, Friday, 8 February 2013 7:27:07 AM
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Robert

I actually agree with all you say although you again fail to acknowledge that without a moral basis right and wrong are made up by each individual.
Posted by runner, Friday, 8 February 2013 9:21:26 AM
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runner, I suspect we do have common ground on that but you stop some steps short. The choice of the god thiests believe in and the verion of that faith is primarily a matter of the culture people are raised in and where its not that it stillinvolves choice outside of absolutes just the values of non-thiests will most often be based around the values of the society people grow up in and involves choice.

Individuals will be more focussed on different aspects of that culture than others and the predominant values will shift over time but believers and non believers still either go with the cultural environment or make a choice themselves about what they believe. The end result still gets back to absolutes.

If there was a clear case of thiests all believing the same set of absolutes across time and distance and non-thiests just making up whatever they wanted you would have a case but thats not the reality.

In the case of what the article describes I don't think its a left right thing as the author seems to be implying, rather that a mindset thats about power and self serving behaviours holds sway across most if not all of the political landscape. Those who conform to the current set of values will generally thrive more than those fighting parts of it.

R0ber
Posted by R0bert, Friday, 8 February 2013 11:05:32 AM
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