Brilliant, thank you. I don't think it will be much longer before the US implodes, sadly.

The selectivity of the gun freaks towards gun rights, neatly set out by Alan Beasley, is matched by as self-serving a selectivity AGAINST gun responsibility – the responsibility of guns for America lurching from gun massacre to gun massacre against a background of nearly 10 thousand gun homicides a year. In their emotional dependence on owning the means to waste fellow-citizens (to say nothing of everything that moves in the forest), these inadequates fill the ether with supposed reasons why so many Americans are getting shot dead – alibis such as

*people on psychiatric medication
*people who should be
*people on legal and/or illegal drugs
*criminals
*kindergarten teachers, cinema ushers, supermarket staffs not armed
*violent videos, films, computer games
*street and domestic bullies
*etc.etc.etc.

But all these are also universal in other countries none of which has an ongoing gun murder crisis. The ONLY difference between America and the rest that can accountant for the epidemic of gun homicide is that it is awash with privately owned guns through a constitutional right-to-be-armed clause which was introduced to calm planters’ fears of rebellious slaves, retained to fortify land grabbers against Native American resistance, and clung to today to protect a large firearm manufacturing industry.

Meanwhile the toll of well-armed, well-trained soldiers in military bases in Afghanistan shot dead by rogue Afghan colleagues has climbed past 50. So much for the lie that firearms make citizens safe when armed killers get the drop on them.

So much for the lie that firearms make citizens safe
Emperor Julian,
Give me one example when a decent, sober minded citizen with a registered firearm was allowed to defend himself or another without being dragged through the courts & persecuted.
Had a soldier witnessed the incident leading up to the murder & shot the women before she killed the soldier he'd have been arrested & never been given the benefit of doubt that he acted to prevent the soldier from being shot. Instead, the woman would have instantly become a martyr.
We see that here too. A decent Policeman who apprehended several crooks over several years gets no mention but if a Cop spends two hours putting on a barbeque for illegal immigrants he gets paraded up & down & medals pinned on his puffed-up chest by some silly Governor General.
It really is all ar$e-about.

What hand-wringing bleeding hearts lobbied for rights for criminals that allowed a felon convicted for killing his mother with a hammer to be released from gaol to plan and carry out a bushwhack murder of representatives of State authority -humble firefighters- he hated so passionately?

What twisted minds could blame the NRA for determined assassins encouraged by a feckless media to believe that multiple killings with their illegal guns was the way to go out in a blaze of glory, while striking back at the State they hated?

What liberal "Progressive" foolishness and blind ideology could disregard their own contributory responsibility for regular murder/suicides when they deliberately give the personal publicity and a detailed 'how-to' recipes through very detailed media descriptions in the media and articles to other likely offenders?

At least 40% of US gun deaths are suicides. No stats are readily available on the number of 'accidents' attributable to fumbled attempts. In Australia guns were never the preferred method of suicide, hanging accounts for the vast majority, but the record from the Howard 'initiatives' clearly demonstrates no reduction in suicide numbers, just some more using rope or car 'accidents' to achieve their purpose.

Rather than dance in the blood of victims and offenders alike to wring political points for "Progressive" left ideology that is obviously failing catastrophically anyhow, why not eschew the political game playing and demand independent university study of the actual causes of violence? Yes, that does carry the risk of displaying the dirty washing, that social and economic policies are likely contributors. Along with the media sensationalising the murder/suicide crimes of course.

EmperorJulian, "So much for the lie that firearms make citizens safe when armed killers get the drop on them."

Is that so? This young mother saved herself and child against knife wielding thugs who broke into her home while she and bub were present.

http://townhall.com/columnists/douggiles/2012/01/08/good_girl_with_gun_lives_bad_guy_with_knife_dies

The thin blue line is severely stretched in Australia too. Where thugs are concerned, police will arrive after the ambulance and just ahead of the Coroner's van.

Only the other day in my village an older chap woke up with some teenagers in his bedroom threatening to assault him. He actually got hold of one & gave him a hiding. He then called the cops who simply weren't interested in chasing down the others. A few days later the little craps returned to belt him but when he brandished a fake gun they scurried. Only hours later the cops turned his place upside down to look for the gun. They weren't at all interested when he asked the cops why they didn't chase down the little craps. Australian justice really boggles the mind.

Looks as if drawing attention to the “sacred Constitution” hypocrisy of the gun-hungry fraternity has brought the usual suspects out of the woodwork. Never takes long. The usual avalanche of non-sequiturs, iffy anecdotes, speculative guesses, calls for a muzzled press and another round of scholarly investigation of new alibis, embedded in the usual US-style freakspeak: “hand-wringing bleeding hearts”, “liberal ‘Progressive’ (in quotes)” “left ideology”.

Let’s beg Graham’s forbearance in using up some space to deal with it, hopefully demonstrating that this reaction to challenges to the right of every Tom, Dick and Harry in the USA to bear arms - a right exercised by a small minority of Americans - ducks the cogent, factual reasoning necessary to make a case.

The non-sequiturs come thick and fast in the website cited as showing that a woman foiled a criminal by (justly) shooting him dead. The web site is a Tea Party freak show full of rubbish about the elected President being a non-American Moslem, and the criminal shot by the woman was not using a gun which means her gun was NOT shown to be an effective defence against guns. If the criminal had had a gun he could have blasted the door open and blown the woman away while she was still fumbling about.

It’s called “getting the drop” which is why gun-armed attackers can usually kill gun-armed as well as unarmed defenders. It’s why more than 50 armed, trained US soldiers have been killed by Afghan “colleagues” and why it is a lie to claim that flooding the country with even more guns will protect people against - you’ve guessed it - guns. That piece of vermin in Newport CT would have had no trouble disposing of armed primary school teachers. [continued. . .]

[continued]

The case against flooding a country with guns is simply that:

*what causes gun death is not drugs, not violent videos, not press reports, not “hand-wringing bleeding hearts” but bullets fired from guns,
*the more ready to hand guns are to malicious people the more people will be killed by their gunfire,
*the more guns in private hands the more will be available, one way or another, to killers,
*the country in which the most guns are in private hands is the one that leads overwhelmingly in the number of people shot dead (latest: USA nearly 10,000 p.a., Britain 41),
*nobody is deprived of anything more than self-indulgence by removing guns from private control,
*the right not to be shot dead outweighs any right to self-indulgence,

T H E R E F O R E

*guns should be kept out of private hands.

But wait! Americans had to be privately armed to protect them from the tyranny of uppity slaves, pesky redskins, sassy wives, elected governments. The entire US constitution is sacrosanct. Gunnies will defend it till their guns are taken from their cold, dead hands. Well here’s their chance. The US Senate has just adopted by 81 votes to 14 laws to allow for US citizens on US soil to be interned INDEFINITELY without trial by the armed forces. That chews up what’s left of the US constitution. Can anyone hear the bugles calling the gunnies to arms?

PS: My sympathy for the bloke who fought off the vermin invading his bedroom, and contempt for the police force who took their side. Lucky it wasn’t America - the returning trash would have had guns and had the drop on the defender. The law is weak, weak, weak on criminal bullies.

Emperor Julian,
I'm one of those who firmly believe that those who genuinely need a firearm should be allowed to have one. I'm totally against high-powered guns which have nothing to do with vermin control or personal safety. No-one needs an assault rifle. Many though do need a .22 or .357 etc non-automatic.
There's absolutely no justification for high powered automatic guns just for target shooting.
Those who frequent the Bush & other dangerous wildlife country should be able to carry a gun, preferably a simple revolver for unhindered defence.

Individual: A single shot .22 or .357 (or .303) is fine for the purposes you mention, but it won't give the gun freaks what they are clamoring so noisily for and brushing aside little matters like avoiding 9-10 thousand gun homicides a year in the gunnies' paradise. It won't give them that buzz which excites sick minds. Beware, sickos like that call the shots (literally!) in America, but they'd grab at the same power in any other country stupid enough to give in to them, as we were before Howard faced them down and said No.

Emperor Julian,
If decent people were allowed to defend themselves & their belongings than the majority of shooting deaths would be crims not decent people. So it would be a good thing for good people to own guns. Again it's not the guns that kill people. It's criminals & Magistrates who cause many avoidable deaths.
If Magistrates were to hit the crims a lot harder instead of persecuting the victims the whole show would be better. Change Laws & you'll change behaviour, simple.

Individual: The answer is for magistrates and Judges and legislation and police to hit crims a lot harder, not spread more guns about for crims and wannabe crims (esp. juvies) to get hold of. Parole boards have a role too. Members of parole boards should be held jointly and severally liable if a crim they sool on to the public reoffends while on parole, for example.

Emperor Julian,
Couldn't agree more with making these morons liable.