TRTL, I think it is most unlikely that any form of land grown plant material can ever be used to produce a viable transport fuel. That is, unless we can find some way of harvesting the methane produced by cows grazing the plant growth.

Once we have to expend the energy necessary to grow, harvest & transport that material to a factory for conversion, it all falls apart. Honest researchers are now admitting that the use of ethanol not only consumes more energy than it provides, but it increases over all CO2 production for distance covered.

However all is not lost, there have been considerable advances made using Legume based resins, & cellulosic materials that could replace petroleum based plastics. Everything was built of wood/plant material for so long, & it is likely to be so, again. I think that's neat.

Of course, as Yabby says, that is really another form of mining, just without digging holes.

Algae that could be easily harvested could be a better idea, than land low volume plants, & a recent post from Spevenlmeyers linked to work on synthetic photosynthesis, which could produce hydrogen directly, which sounds quite possible. Now that really would be solar power.

It may not be what the greenies want to hear, but new technology does seem to be showing civilisation will survive. It is just not the ones, like wind & solar, so loved by greens & pollies alike that are going to get us there

Hasbeen,
There is all that heat down there under the ground in granite
with enough to last for hundreds or thousands of years.
Once built it would be very ERoEI good.
From what I have read the rock is heated by radio active decay in the
granite. If the half life is some thousands or even 100s of thousands
of years it would seem to be a crime not to make an all out effort
to make it work. They have already made steam blow out of the hole.

Perhaps it is because it comes from radio activity it is a no no for
the greens and government.

Bazz I hope you're right. I don't care where the power comes from, as long as it comes. Perhaps someone in a shed somewhere is working on an idea which will make them richer than Bill Gates, & keep the lights on.

Unfortunately for us, the best hot rock sights so far found in Oz are a long way from a good water supply, or from the sight of most power use, but that may change. I've have read however, that our rocks cool down too quickly to achieve economical power production from them.

Back on topic, there has to be something going wrong in this trade thing somewhere.

Some years back I was producing some brass products. It was getting hard to compete.

I was amazed to find that Asian countries could;
Buy our copper & zinc concentrates;
Ship them to Asia;
Follow them with our coal to power the conversion of them to brass;
Use that same power to make finished products;
Then ship those products to Oz, to land into my store for less than I could buy the brass to make them in Oz.

The same appears to be the case with steel fabrications, using our iron ore & coal. Value adding doesn't seem to be our forte.

Ahhh, yes Hasbeen,
Isn't it marvelous what you can do with cheap energy and low wages.
Pity it won't go on forever.

Hasbeen,

Back on topic?

THE greatest economist fallacy is about OIL and Coal lasting forever OR until some magical future power source WILL be found.

The discussion about GEOTHERMAL highlights this & is MOST definitely ON TOPIC!

TRTL,

Racism is in the eye of the beholder. SUSTAINABILITY is EVERY PERSON's concern and must be CAPITALISED if indeed ignorant 'toddlers' insist on believing in santa claus economics, tooth fairy solutions and too recent immigrants in Australian politics desiring sustainable population with sustainable practices.

PS When comments are based on the Second Law of Thermodynamics no further proof is required. Unless of course you don't understand basic Physics. Unless you don't understand this country cannot sustainably support more than 20 million first-world aspirant people.