Atman - lets have a look at your comments.

"Compared to coal, solar and wind are very expensive."

Define expensive. Given that burning coal and other fossil fuels will cause climate chaos (as per the science) that makes them unbelievably expensive. And I think we can see how much it costs to clear up after extreme weather events (ref Queensland).

"A carbon tax ...... has dubious scientific merit".

No it doesn't - the reverse is true - as per my previous post "no scientific body of national or international standing rejects the findings of human-induced effects on climate change."

".... and according to many experts, won't have much of an effect on overall CO2 levels for a long time."

The short term goal is to reduce the increase in CO2 levels, then stablilise, and ultimately reduce. The speed at which this will occur will depend on the carbon price which depends on political will. The mechanism though is fine. Why would you think it wouldn't work?

"Carbon tax is about economic equity and wealth transfer as dictated by the UN not 'pollution' which is why many developing countries are let off the hook with their emission targets. Their CO2 apparently is less offensive to the environment than Western CO2."

You are ignoring the science again but I agree that compensating the lower paid and pensioners in Australia but not others is a mild form of wealth transfer. A bit like the Queensland flood levy being paid only by those above a certain income threshold.

If there is to be any wealth transfer between rich and poor nations (a big if) to me it would be justified by the fact that the developed countries have largely caused the problem that now affects every nation. There is underlying justice in that every citizen should be allowed the same level of CO2 emissions - accepting this developed nations need to reduce dramatically whereas developing nations may still have some room to grow emissions.

Atman.....The problem with the fossil fuel junkies, its like any other addiction......its easier to go back for another hit, while knowing full well the consequences of their actions:) We can see who backs the BIG BOYS and the reasons why. Hasbeen........What does equal opportunity mean to all concerned?

Is it the environment?

Is it just for the rich?

is it for the future generations?

or is it just, that your set in your ways:)
6 to 7 billion people Hasbeen, all chewing in and around the planets surface with second and third world people all wanting to join in on the feast:) Coal, uranium, oil......yes the magic bullet to save all on the earth...lol.....The evidence is well against you.

But you know what they say, you cant teach an old dog new tricks!

However I think we can:)

LE

Quantumleap, since you have declined the invitation and suggested I always do a better job anyway, I’ll take up that invitation.

We are trying to explain why the support for AGW comes 80% from Greens, 60% from the ALP and 30% from the Lib/Nats.

Let’s kick a few words around just to start the ball rolling.

Logic Ideology
Skepticism Faith
Cynicism Belief
Independent Group think
Reality Dreaming
Open Closed
Rationality Irrational
Ambivalent Belligerent
Passive Hostile
Cautious Polarized
Inclusive Divisive
Means Ends
Factual Exaggerated
Strategic Tactical
Questions Answers
Listening Judgmental
Asking Telling
Knowledge Information
Challenging Abusive
Spontaneous Structured
Leaders Followers
Explanation Justification
Broad Narrow
Direct Obtuse
Critiques Defensive
Multiple possibilities Single orthodoxy

All you have to do LEA, (and perhaps you might wish to get some assistance from Rich 2 and Sophie Trevitt with the hard bits) is to assign one set of attributes, as you see fit, to either one block or the other. You will of course have to explain your choices but other than that it is very simple. So simple in fact that most on OLO will have already done it for you. But we would love to hear your results rather that taking your wickets home

Quantum how can we have equal opportunity when some want to send everyone to the poor house, & some don't want to go? I will give you the opportunity to live 100% as you like, but you will have to turn your power off for 50% of peak hour.

Come back in a year & tell us if you still believe. Perhaps you are one of the elites who believe that any restrictions won't apply to you. Mate have we got news for you.

Rich if you don't know what "hide the decline" is you definitely aren't qualified to speak on climate change. Google it, & climate gate, & learn how you have been conned.

[Deleted for abuse.]

Oh look! Somethings made spindoc angry...lol...calm down:) No your right...its far too hard for me:)

There!...your ego's still intact.

Now when was the last time I when for last psychiatric evaluation:)

Spindoc...please....

LEA