daprhys,

I think Bess is a courageous women. Please tell her there are many people who support her and hope she is not intimidated by political Aboriginies in the cities.

Dilan,

I think you wrote a sane artical in what can be an ideologically driven area. I have one big disagreement though. You wrote:

"That said, Aboriginality is a complex topic and there is little to be gained by looking backwards and casting aspersions on others"

This couldn't be further from the truth. I recently heard Jenny Macklin talk in remote Australia. She quoted Einstein (I think) saying that the definition of stupidity is to keep doing the same thing and expect a different outcome. My first thought was 'like 40 years of indigenous policy'!

The last 40 years of indigenous policy had brought nothing but suffering for remote indigenous Australians. Yet urban elites still pursue their failed rights agenda. How much longer do remote Australians have to suffer for their pride?

Bess Price mentioned the missionaries on 7:30 tonight. I have spoken with many older aboriginies who were taught by the missionaries. Many of them said the missionaries were hard but as least we learnt. People had self respect and self discipline. When they left many communities had working cattle stations, viable small aircraft companies and farming enterprises. But all is gone now. How much longer do remote indigenous people have to suffer before we recognise the agenda of the past 40 years has failed? How much longer do they suffer for the vanity of the Left?

Loudmouth,

The people you mention are urban political Aboriginies. They have very little in common with remote Aboriginies.

Andrew Bolt has been taken to court because he criticied these blond haired blue eyed aboriginies for taking scholarships and other benefits meant for disadvanted aborigines.

Aboriginality needs to return to a culural and ethnic basis rather than a political one. Currently all you need to do to claim aboriginality is to claim acceptance by other aboriginals. In the cities this often means being accepted by other hangers-on with no cultural and virtually no ethnic connection to aboriginal heritage.

Bolt's point was that these people are abusing the system and taking away a much needed step up for the people who need it most. Urban hangers-on are the people who have the most to lose from a move away from the rights agenda. That is why they attack critics like Bess Price with such vitriol and why they try to shut down public debate with court actions. It is always those who have the most to lose who fight the hardest.

Dane

YOu mention the 7.30 report tonight where the dignified Bess said
'Bess Price mentioned the missionaries on 7:30 tonight. I have spoken with many older aboriginies who were taught by the missionaries. Many of them said the missionaries were hard but as least we learnt. '

I have spoken to a number of elders who confirm Bess opinion and also missionaries who spent up to 50 years working in communities for little to no pay. Most of the Government workers today only go out to the communities because they are on huge salaries or can't get work anywhere else. I am not blaming the workers for this but the fact is they do it for pay unlike many of the missionaries (not all) who did it because they cared for the people.

Your statement/question says it all

'How much longer do they suffer for the vanity of the Left? '

are encapsulated in lifelong welfare.
Loudmouth,
Ever thought about who is doing this encapsulating ?

Dilan,

I doubt that any opponent of the Intervention would argue that the problems identified in the report, 'Little Children are Sacred' did not require urgent action. The point of contention is over the form of the action that was ultimately taken. Many Indigenous people (not only 'elites') were concerned by coercive measures that had little to do with child abuse, such as the compulsory acquisition of Indigenous lands.

You seem to think that it is irrelevent that the recommendations in 'Little Children are Sacred' were ignored by the Howard and Gilliard Governments alike. Furthermore, you cannot refer to anywhere else in the world where this kind of Intervention has been implemented, let alone proven to succeed. How does the Intervention sit with internationally recognised models of best practice? Or is such research only relevant to the puny vanities of the 'Indigenous elite'?

It sounds so enticing when you distinguish between implementation of a policy and the policy itself, so that unintended consequences of the former do not undermine the latter. The problem is that you can't point to a single piece of research that indicates that the Intervention is succeeding in reducing child abuse. Once again, Dilan, are you seriously suggesting that credible research in this area is irrelevant?

Hi Individual,

I'd defer to your knowledge and experience any day, so when you ask " .... Ever thought about who is doing this encapsulating ?" I'd be happy to take my guidance from you.

Still, not to duck the question, I would say that whoever takes away the sense of agency, of responsibility, from the people, whoever does things for them that they can, or should be able to, do for themselves - government agencies, Aboriginal organisations, the ivory-tower academics - has been, perhaps unwittingly, trapping people in remote and rural settlements, and in outer suburbs of most big cities, in lifelong and utter dependence.

But even at the cost of being accused of 'blaming the victim', and from a comfortable distance here in Adelaide, I would have to say that to a large extent, the people themselves, especially the men, have at least encouraged that dependence, and that response from government agencies and Aboriginal organisations. What do you reckon :)

Turn the question around: who wants that entrapment, that dependence, to continue ? not just agencies and organisations and academics and bodies like CAEPR - their self-interest in perpetuating dependence is pretty obvious. But do many of the people, especially the men want, desperately want, to gain skills, even for low-level and menial work - like most migrants have to do when they first come out to Australia (or country people moving to the cities, for that matter) - in order to give their kids a better future ?

[TBC]

Joe