http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?article=11265#190061

Ho Hum, you know better than i do that fascism is not now & never was "Right Wing". It is another form of socialism.

Can you "Please Explain" any practical differences between China, North Korea, Saudi Arabia, today & 1930's Spain, Italy or Germany?

Art as you also well know is usually "Hatred" disguised by "Humour" with Sarcasm, Spin, Propaganda, Weasel Words, etc, etc, etc.

Are you seriously suggesting that 2 wrongs, don't make a right, but 4 or 5 DO?

http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?article=11265#190116

Dear Sqeers, first read the above, then "Please Explain" that the Red/green/getup/labour/socialist Alliance has never been in government federal, state, or local, anywhere in OZ over the last 50 years.

Then tell me that they are not "Conspiring" to steal from low, middle & even high income earners via an ETS to hand the money over to filthy, stinking rich, international banksters.

"Socialism is the Royal Road to Power for the Super Rich".

After the LNP win the next QLD state election, the asset sales proceeds will be long gone, spending will still continue being high till then, debt principal will have been reduced by 10% at best, several of treasuries best "Cash Cows" will be gone, throw "Double Dip" GFC2 into it & revenues will be way down.

In order to keep schools & hospitals running, all other forms of government spending will have to be slashed to pieces, including "The Yartz".

Thanks to you & other Communists like Anna Gillard, we are about to enter a brave new "Orwellian" world.

Dear formersnag,
you can call the powers that be anything you like but that don't make it so. The fact is that the global agenda, undoubtedly underway, is a capitalist one. We live under a global capitalist system that farms human creativity, culture, society for profit. Humanity is reduced to the status of herds of cattle, which, to add injury to insult, are unsustainably farmed. We're consuming the planet so that capitalist monopolies and their hangers-on can keep loading-up their coffers.

Like it or not it is the Left that traditionally perceives humanity's demeaned and exploited state and wishes to put an end to the manifold destruction, misery and alienation that are by-products.

The Labor Party, Greens etc. are not remotely Left or communist, just as the conservatives are not fascists. True left and right parties can only be extremely marginal. As the Greens garner more of the vote they will continue to move closer to the centre. Any political contenders must need be as bovine (centred/populist) as the world's democracies (feed lots). Isn't this logical? These unthinking centres (majorities) are unprincipled and conservative=just keep the troughs full. This is what ostensibly Left and Right governments are obliged to do or be voted out--no?
But there is also an international agenda that interferes and threatens these states (in the global context) of regional glut. That agenda=efficiencies: expand and refine farming practices. The world is being converted into one mega-farm, thus stabalising and rationalising production and securing and maximising profit.
If the true Left had its way it would overthrow the whole disgusting venture and build a world based on individual self-determination, sufficiency and husbandry: a utopian dream to counter are dytopian reality.
You can label everything a communist plot if you like, but the last time I checked it was the capitalists running the show. Not the communists. The ruling political ideology is neither left nor right, but the profit motive.

http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?article=11265#190221

Dear Squeers, Love the first sentence.

You can call a Communist a "Democratic Socialist" or a Red, a green as often as you like, then use weasel words to try & spin the "Thinking Centrists" like Tony Abbott & i into not seeing your communist policies for what they really are.

Haven't you heard of Fabian Socialism? You know, introduce communism by creeping gradualism, instead of revolution.

The Renaissance & Protestant Christianity were products of the thinking, centrist, middle classes.

Communism was invented by Illuminati Monarchists to regain control. Every "Left Wing Think Tank", "Green NGO" for several hundred years now has been funded by "Tax Deductible Donations" from "International Banksters".

The saddest part of all is that almost everything else you said was correct, only you applied the wrong labels to it all. The Global Agenda is an Evil Conspiracy between both the Radical, Extreme, "Loony Left" & the Radical, Extreme, "Raving Right", in which everybody else "Gets Screwed".

Compere Australia's economy between 1945 & 1965, with what it has been degenerating into ever since 1972?

Radical, Extreme, Free Enterprise, Globalised, Free Trade has nothing whatsoever, to do with true "Private Enterprise Capitalism", it is in fact, Communism by proxy.

The ruling global political ideology is indeed both left & right stealing from the middle.

We have had enough of this. The formally silent majority are about to wipe the Red/green/getup/labour/socialist Alliance off the face of the earth & the LNP as well, if they don't wake up to themselves, extremely, quickly.

If all that is so, Formersnag, can you tell me what the motivation of the communists is? Communists by definition want a classless society based on shared ownership of the means of production=no one gets rich and the future is provided for (under capitalism we live hand to mouth. The future is cashed-in as profit). So if the plot is not aimed at that, it can't be communist. If it is aimed at that (but of course it most definitely is not), I'm all for it. I would rather live plainly but honestly and sustainably.
All capitalist economies are based on unsustainable growth and bust and boom. The boom you refer to after the war was based on permanent war economies and consumerism but was never sustainable (just as welfare capitalism is not sustainable because it's too much of a drain on profits). The recent boom (an illusion) was based on cheap commodities out of China and unsustainable credit. The world economy is set for another plunge yet, or double dip, but in my view the glory days you allude to are over for good. Of course the good old days of plenty you repine were only enjoyed by portions of populations in rich countries like Australia, and at the expense of the exploited working classes at home and abroad (in Australia's case mainly the latter of course). So when you say "We have had enough of this", you fail to realise that the elite lifestyle you lament was never sustainable or fair anyway. By unsustainable, I mean (apart from environmentally) it wasn't commensurable with the ever-diminishing returns and extraction of profit that comprise capitalism's entropic dynamic.
You cannot disregard the larger context of which "we" are a part. The party's over.

*Communists by definition want a classless society based on shared ownership of the means of production=no one gets rich and the future is provided for*

Ah Squeers, you keep dreaming. We know what happens in the real
world. The leaders live in pomp and splendour, as they feather
their own nests, the workers get no choice.

Count yourself lucky, rather then as a cow, but of course that
is your choice too. Our present system is the closest thing
there is, to what happens in nature. ie every creature needs to
make a living somehow. It just depends on their natural aptitude,
as to how they want to do that.

The reality remains that no system gives you the choices that our
present one does, to make your choices and live your dreams. But
of course we can't make the old horse drink, if its too stubborn to
see the water trough.

Our system is certainly not a capitalist one. For Govts spend around
40% or more of GDP, so most of us productive ones spend at least
5 months a year, working for nothing but the community. Hardly
capitalism in action.

Art? So do art, if that floats your boat. Just don't expect the
rest of us to bankroll your lifestyle for you. As in nature, every
creature needs to make a living. Those artists, as in many musicians,
who appeal to the public, are amply rewarded. The rest rely
on our altruism and goodwill, so that they have no need to make
a real living. The benevolance of capitalism keeps them fed.

Dear Dr Pangloss (Yabby),

I'm very familiar with your default position by now and could easily oppose your assertions with their respective contradictions, but I don't want to derail this thread further. So perhaps another time.

Dear Jane,
I have six kids and encourage them to explore art, music and literature. In fact they need very little encouragement even in our computer age when more and more artistic experience is pre-written and commodified rather than spontaneous. As you would know, however, aesthetic experience has been theorised out of existence in recent decades and artistic expression is either conformist or politically aware. I'm disappointed that the skills you attribute to art are merely pragmatic, including statements such as that they are "important to numerous careers"; that's not why I encourage my kids to be artistic. Can't you see how conservative, indeed Panglossian, this is in taking the social context for granted?
In my opinion, in our utterly scripted lives the arts are vital as cultural-criticism, and not the "self-criticism" you affirm (which implies subjective discipline and conformity with the context, which goes unchallenged), and for exploring alternative social contexts wherein artistry and craftsmanship might be indulged both practically and for their own sakes.