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The Forum > Article Comments > It’s not whether you win or lose > Comments

It’s not whether you win or lose : Comments

By Graham Young, published 27/7/2010

Julia Gillard is going to win. But that doesn’t mean that Tony Abbott can’t be a winner too.

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Looks like this article was written before the latest polls that indicate the election result is leaning Labor's way but not much more.

It seems to me that the Labor campaign people are doing their level best to lose this election. Julia Gillard is Labor's best asset by far, yet they have reduced her to slogans. She is great when she's being Julia, but what we are getting instead is this wind-up doll spouting rehearsed lines. She's been a great debater in the past, yet in this campaign she has squibbed it on climate change and now on population as well. And $2000 for your old clunker - what is she, a used car salesman now? She has even let the demise of Kevin Rudd become an issue that should never have been. The guy was a pr*ck so what she did was a good thing. Instead, she's gone all coy about it. The Libs should be toasting the ALP campaign organisers every night.

The real Julia Gillard can win this election comfortably. She should sack her campaign advisers and be herself.
Posted by huonian, Tuesday, 27 July 2010 10:24:16 AM
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Unfortunately many Australians don't worry to much about their credit card debt until its to late. It is fun having a totally irresponsible spending spree and it will more than likely take another term and much more debt before people wake up to the fact that their are no free lunches.
Posted by runner, Tuesday, 27 July 2010 11:02:05 AM
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Huonian observes of Julia Gillard:

"She's been a great debater in the past,
yet in this campaign she has squibbed it
on climate change and now on population
as well. And $2000 for your old clunker -
what is she, a used car salesman now?"

Apropos acquiring the old clunkers, I somehow don't think this will be seen as a good look in terms of a direct trade-off:

http://www.smartcompany.com.au/finance/20100726-solar-sector-furious-after-gillard-robs-industry-to-fund-new-cash-for-clunkers-deal.html

Without knowing the relative significance or effectiveness of the respective funding deployments, one would have to think this sends a signal out of all proportion to what, if anything, could be achieved thereby, a signal guaranteed to put those concerned about sustainability of energy sources right off side. I would have thought such to be predominantly erstwhile intending Labor voters. Not brilliant.
Posted by Forrest Gumpp, Tuesday, 27 July 2010 12:12:18 PM
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I agree that Labor will retain Government; but only because Australians have to be dragged down to rock bottom before they get the message. Gillard Labor will certainly give them the message over the next three years. With the aid – and the insistence, if enough idiots second preference them – of the Greens, Gillard Labor will continue with hikes in prices; hikes in population; hikes in illegal entry, and a general running down of the economy with a boosting of debt.

In three years time, even the Left-wing media will be saying that ‘Labor must go.”

So dense are Australian voters that the first term of this Labor Government hasn’t been enough punishment and deprivation for them; they need even more abuse before the will get the message.
Posted by Leigh, Tuesday, 27 July 2010 1:53:56 PM
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I'm not really fussed what the 2-party preferred polls say. My gut feeling is that swinging voters vote, rightly or wrongly, for who they want to be Prime Minister. Tony Abbott has a lot of catching up to do if that is the case.
Posted by Phil Matimein, Tuesday, 27 July 2010 2:02:37 PM
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Phil Matimein

My "gut feeling" tells me the race for PM would be a lot closer had the Liberals retained Malcolm Turnbull. However, the remnants of Howard's regime couldn't deal with the idea of someone even remotely left of their ideology.
Posted by Severin, Tuesday, 27 July 2010 2:24:32 PM
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'However, the remnants of Howard's regime couldn't deal with the idea of someone even remotely left of their ideology.'

and then again we have a fraudster who is pretending to be much further to the right than her convictions. I suppose that's the difference (ie one fraudster and one who maintains some of his convictions). Then again a woman prepared to stab the PM in his back after being one of the privileged four is not going to be terribly honest. That is probably why the left feel so comfortable with her.
Posted by runner, Tuesday, 27 July 2010 2:30:34 PM
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"I had a job for twenty-five bob
And I socked the manager in the gob
And I left, left, left, right, left!"

Sorry, I couldn't resist it!

Left? Right? - who really cares?

Why is it that if we made the members of
both major political parties swap places,
after two days no one would notice the
difference?

The question we need to ask ourselves is -
Which Party do you think would better run the
country? Then go vote for it!

The voters always get it right in the end.
Fingers-crossed they will this time as well!
Posted by Foxy, Tuesday, 27 July 2010 8:52:37 PM
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"Moving forward" one step

and back two.
Posted by Shadow Minister, Tuesday, 27 July 2010 9:58:58 PM
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After watching QandA last night, I agree with Severin that if Malcolm Turnbull was still in charge of the Liberals, we would have a much tighter race.
He is the far superior leader that the foolish Liberal party should never have stabbed in the back.

I agree that Julia and Labor will probably win this election, given the dreadful alternative of the embarrassingly poor public speaker, holier-than-thou, 'action' man, Abbott.

If Malcolm Turnbull was still at the helm, I would consider voting for the liberals. I am upset that Julia Gillard will not agree to all citizens having the right to marry- regardless of their sexuality.

However, I would sooner have the Greens in power than suffer having Tony Abbott as our Prime Minister.
Posted by suzeonline, Wednesday, 28 July 2010 12:52:56 AM
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This article is actually a good summary.
It says a lot about Liberal politics that the writer, who seems a reasonable enough individual, is utilised as a blog moderator/editor etc, while the sort of dill the libs had to sack the other day for racist remarks, is presented as a rational, state of the art choice/alternative even for Australians.
Not that Labor, also infested with factions filled with empty careerists, does much better or different.
To me, this election really bespeaks of the changes in autonomy and power visited upon nation states through globalisation: None of our supposed politics, is where real decisons are made any more.
Posted by paul walter, Wednesday, 28 July 2010 1:01:33 AM
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I can’t find any inspiration in either LAB or LIB. Domestically their policies are pretty close with the LIBs further right wing and harsher on those on the lower economic scales.

The international policies of LAB and LIB are what have turned me off them.

The kowtowing and allegiances are invariably in the interests of foreign powers and rarely in Australia’s. Politicians openly compromise their suitability for election to office when they accept fully paid holidays overseas, offered by agents of foreign Gov’t’s in the guise of “study or familiarity tours”. Spouses of politician’s employed or closely associated with foreign lobbyist’s doesn’t enhance, it compromises the politician’s integrity.

Promoting the Anzus Treaty to being of the highest priority in foreign policy maintenance and strategy is stupid and firmly embedded in WW2 principles. The world since WW2 has changed immeasurably in the conduct of war making the posture of Anzus outdated, irrelevant and inoperable which goes doubly since the treaty is a hollow document that has never imposed any military obligation on the US.

The LIBs and LAB often yield submitting instead to adopting the policies of “Allies” that ultimately support corrupt regimes or regimes that are clearly pursuing polices of genocide, apartheid and ethnic cleansing of their indigenes. But nonetheless LAB and LIB platforms embrace such policies for reasons of craving continued membership of the world dominating “Club” regionally serving only to alienate Australia further from its own neighbours.

Tiny little NZ has shown us the way of acting in its own best interests first, regardless of souring relations with larger powers. For instance NZ’s declaration of the NZ Nuclear Free Zone, Disarmament and Arms Control Act including the South Pacific Nuclear Free Zone Treaty. NZ barred nuclear-powered or nuclear-armed ships from using NZ ports or entering NZ waters in protest of continued French nuclear testing in the South Pacific and in opposition to US policy of continued aggressive confrontation of the Soviet Union. The US Navy could no longer enter NZ territory and so they expelled NZ from the Anzus Treaty, downgrading NZ’s status from “Ally” to “Friend”....ho hum!
Posted by Westralis, Wednesday, 28 July 2010 2:44:14 AM
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I am disgusted with the members of the political parties who have got into power since 1970, they have no knowledge, intelligence, loyalty or decency, looking at the morass they have driven the economy into for our workers and small business - as well as others. The big demand that we keep exporting more and more of our non-renewable and non-value-added resources, is only the demand of idiots or total traitors. The payment to the mining companies and the Government, for these exports, is made by the prices we pay for the imports from those countries whether it is China, Japan, USA, UK, Germany or whoever. I don't deny that those people who are employed by the mining companies and those maintaining the equipment need consideration, however it would be much better if they were justly employed in Australian manufacturing for providing a good economy and environment for our descendants and for their future; the export mining won't provide for that. Our problem comes mainly from the intelligence – or lack of , by the people “chosen by the political parties to be our representatives” in parliament. There is no way are those people chosen, properly represent a true section of the Australian community, there are too many lawyers for one thing, and as the present PM and treasurer and previously ones as well, particularly since the 1970's, when the economy, intelligence, decency and really - all things relative to a successful progressive country, have been put into the old dunny can and thrown into the river. If the group who pulled off the replacement of Kevin Rudd, had helped to ensure that the earlier exploits, the insulation and other efforts, were successful; they were an attempt to improve things for the low paid and unemployed, and the betrayal by Wayne Swan, not to place a proper personal tax in the budget, but setting it up to further destroy the economy, makes you wonder what at his mentallity. Previous polls about the most trusted in the community mentions Politicians and Lawyers about last, and they have proved it.
Posted by merv09, Wednesday, 28 July 2010 8:00:25 AM
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Today, Wednesday, I think the election is quickly turning into a contest with a focus on competence rather than policy.

Gillard's performance today was dull witted. She at this stage after all her blunders is now trying to convince the electorate that she is a 'conviction' policitian.

Abbott took the lead into the election with two issues Paid Parental Leave and laterly Mental Health funding. He's leading and Gillard is very much reacting to those two Liberal positions. For a PM in an election that displays great incompetence.

On nearly every policy position she has adopted, serious flaws have been exposed. That will be seen as incompetent. Who doesn't test their policy before presenting it for the electorate to judge.

She was clearly outdone in the great debate where Abbott presented as PM material and more importantl effectively portayed competence. Gillard was left mouthing slogans and motherhood statements.

Disunity is death in politics. It is something the media have emphasised in the past, usually in regard to the Liberals, and voters know it's true. The 'leaks' Gillard is defending against are hard evidence of this and the results will show over the next two weeks.

Gillard's appearance today was relatively bedraggled and hints of nervous laughter and misplaced light humour, at journalists expense, betrayed a faltering self-confidence. It stuck out especially after the attention that has been paid to her appearance. And to see a PM asking '...give me a break' was astonishing.

As to the performance of personnel Bishop, Hockey, Pyne and Morrison are highlighting the stark differences in competence between the teams. Where are Wong, Garrett, Roxon, Swan, and the rest?

Finally Abbotts family relationships drip competence.

Gillards relationships, past and present... well the public perception of that will be ... probably something quite different to Abbotts. Competence will be high on the list of criteria on which they are judged.

Increasingly the Labor campaign is becoming a shambles, that is being revealed, not by her compliant media nor the Liberals, but by the cheap thrills and shallow thinking associated with labor policy and personnel.
Posted by keith, Wednesday, 28 July 2010 11:03:54 AM
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Keith,

yes Labor is looking pretty ordinary thus far. I would have thought Labor (and Gillard)would have done better.

The money is still all for Labor. Sportsbet has the coaliton at $3.75 and Labor $1.25.

Maybe Labor will win with Green preferences.
Posted by Chris Lewis, Wednesday, 28 July 2010 12:01:03 PM
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"There’s no obvious coherence to what he’s (Abbott) offering at the moment."

That is a standout observation, Graham. Abbott is a loose cannon. His effort to display P.M. gravitas is laughable. Some people are moved to tears by it.

At least in budgiesmugglers he looked authentic!
Posted by David G, Wednesday, 28 July 2010 2:34:01 PM
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I long since got tired of listening to hard policies that evaporate in the cold light of the reality, government after the election.

As a business person I'm unimpressed by presidential personality cults...

Negative and slight of hand advertising i.e. we won't screw up as much as the current government simply insults every one, particularly the public treating them like frightened cattle.

As a citizen I am annoyed by hip pocket nerve that bend to self-interest of corporation or power groups to the detriment of the people.

But most of all I find that parties/acolytes etc that focus on dogma and on the winning as though it's an end unto its self,rather than the task they seek the absolute bottom of the barrel. if you aim low don't be surprised if you achieve low.

I take elections as job interviews i.e. would I hire them to run my corporation, Australia.

More specifically is the candidate in my electorate competent enough to be MY/Our representative to help run the corp.
Sure I'm *interested* in who is the chief but my vote is of no value in choosing him or her.

Graham, my point to you is not if Abbott/Gillard is a winner or loser. Neither is it about policy because Rudd (according to majority started off with that) but are we getting a competent deliverer of what the people (all of us) need. A steady hand on the tiller not hysterical reactionary changes to win.

Accordingly My vote will be against our local member not necessarily against any party much less leader
Posted by examinator, Wednesday, 28 July 2010 6:36:05 PM
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David G.

You know every time I see commentators or the media deride Abbott for wearing his speedo's I get really bloody annoyed.

You see they are surf club attire. I used to wear them nearly every summer weekend when my kids were in 'nippers'. I'd do water safety in them, with the 'nippers' and then take my turn with the beach patrol at least for an afternoon each weekend.

I don't think you intend to deride those great Australian iconic activities, but you are.

Don't you think such negativity short-sighted?
What message are you and other people passing to the the kids of the next generation?
That it's not cool to be fit, healthy and engaged in a great iconic Australian outdoor volunteer community service?

You ougth to know better and shouldn't show such disrespect for those of us who have had involvement in and are proud of the Surf Lifesaving movement of Australia.
Posted by keith, Thursday, 29 July 2010 8:53:40 AM
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Dear Keith, please don't get your knickers in a knot.

I have the greatest admiration for the Surf Lifesaving Movement and have always been an avid surfer myself.

I think Tony would be best served if he became the Minister for Sport. As a prospective Prime Minister he is a complete dud.

Listening to his stop-go speech patterns is tedious. It's as though his brain needs oiling!

Cheers.
Posted by David G, Thursday, 29 July 2010 11:55:32 AM
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Severin:>> My "gut feeling" tells me the race for PM would be a lot closer had the Liberals retained Malcolm Turnbull.<<

Perhaps but we would be paying a carbon tax that does not address the issue. A boon for the brokerage houses, another added fixed cost to the tax payer.
Posted by sonofgloin, Thursday, 29 July 2010 3:26:23 PM
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Coalition into $2.85 with sportsbet. I would have thought Labor $1.60 and Coalition $2.10 would have reflected closeness of election.

I feel that Labor is not impressing with their campaign. Abbott sharper and more concise.

Labor may pull it off, but whether they should win is another matter based on their first term
Posted by Chris Lewis, Saturday, 31 July 2010 8:00:29 AM
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