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The Forum > Article Comments > Poor kids; poor parents; poor future > Comments

Poor kids; poor parents; poor future : Comments

By Phil Cullen, published 16/7/2010

Without a doubt education is a turbulent mess in Australia, for which we can thank Julia Gillard.

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What has happened to the understanding of developmental learning.

I watched it fail my child as the ill prepared teachers at the independent school she attended were over run by a system that placed enormous demands on the limited time available.
Developmental learning is a fantasy that requires many more resources and thousands more teachers in much smaller classes to have even a hope of working. We might all see this as the best way to do it but the economic reality is far too harsh.

Never mind criticising the long over due national curiculum or education standards that are better than ever and constantly evolving, rather take a good look at the fool in the mirror. The parents that are sure their child is being failed by the school system because they can not reach the unrealistic standards set by a parent that most of the time didn't perform any better themselves.

The area of failure in schools at the moment is in social development. The good old days you all remember when the teachers did all, also involved a good dose of physical and psychological punishment that destroyed as many students as it made. To truly develop our social and welfare systems within our schools we need to invest into professionals who work in this area and begin developing playground programs that will help children understand and develop social skills. Teachers have enough to do trying to reach parents unrealistic expectations without having to teach their children how to behave for them as well.
Posted by nairbe, Friday, 16 July 2010 8:34:16 PM
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I find it absurd that a federal education minister (or former minister) is held to account for the 'turbulent mess' that is school education in Australia. Schools are run by the states, whose leaders scream blue murder every time the feds suggest a hostile takeover.

Phil Cullen, a former director of primary schooling in Queensland (arguably the most widely criticised education sector in the country), was in a position to implement change and to improve education. He didn't. He officiated in a system that has a track record of failing. He is now lashing out at a system that may well fail, but has not failed yet because it has not even been implemented yet, and at a PM who has essentially said that people like him have not done a good enough job, so now it's her turn.

I have my doubts about a 'one size fits all' approach to education. I also have my doubts about the ways in which this curriculum is being implemented. As an idea, it is terrific: by the end of their schooling careers, every student in Australia will have achieved the same benchmarks. As a process, it is rushed: students are starting from different places but are expected to operate at the same level, and achieve success in the same system, within the next two years. We have our work cut out for us.

If it works, it won't be Gillard with the egg on her face - it will be the naysayers and the people who did nothing for so long - people like Cullen. If it doesn't work, Gillard will be relegated to the same pool of non-achievers as the state authorities.
Posted by Otokonoko, Friday, 16 July 2010 10:17:27 PM
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The author doesn’t like an American system, yet almost 100% of software being used in the schools is from the US, and more and more textbooks are now from the US.

Most of the software and textbooks have been requested by teachers.

QLD teachers where each given a laptop paid for by the QLD public. The teachers then placed 20 programs on these laptops, all programs came from the US, with no content from QLD or Australia.

Some months later, the teachers began a series of strikes wanting more pay, and of course that extra pay had to come from the QLD taxpayer.

Priamary school teachers in QLD spend on average only 5% of their time teaching science, and 15 year old students in QLD now have the lowest interest in science in the western world.

The results are immense for our future economy, when a skilled workforce is necessary to compete in the global economy.

The current education system in QLD is probably QLD’s greatest obstacle towards forward progress.
Posted by vanna, Saturday, 17 July 2010 12:19:45 PM
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Come on, vanna.

1) Yes, software like the Microsoft Office package is American, and is used in schools. I'm not sure what the problem is there.

2) I have yet to use an American textbook in any of my classes. A quick look at the maths, science, SOSE and English textbooks carried around by my students reveals that they are almost all local - not only Australian, but developed in Queensland to address specific Queensland outcomes and essential learnings.

3) We should be alarmed that the employer provided computers for teachers to use when preparing work, completing their administrative duties and communicating with parents and students?

4) State school teachers had one strike, not a series of strikes. Some diocesan Catholic schools also went on strike a while later - again, one strike: not a series.

5) From where did you pull your stats about teaching of science? 5% = 1.25 hours a week. I know of no primary teachers who dedicate that little time to science.

I certainly agree with your last two points and, in particular, your last point: that the current education system is QLD's biggest obstacle to progress. That and relics from this system, like Phil Cullen, who admit that it is broken but vehemently object to any change that they didn't think of themselves.
Posted by Otokonoko, Saturday, 17 July 2010 12:51:45 PM
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Regards problems in todays education systems:

Problem#1 In my opinion (as an employer) - appalling levels of poor literacy, including spelling and numeracy as encountered in job applicants and employees in late teens (School leavers) to mid-twenties age group.

Problem#2 Result perhaps of all this 'individual creativity' written about in earlier posts - an almost pathological inability to follow processes. You train them until you are breathless to carry out tasks, which for various reasons must be done to specific standards, then, in open view, they will invariably try to do things their way.

Problem#3 The belief it's their right to use personal mobile devices and workplace computers for own reasons during work hours. You should realise their needs and tolerate this. You should also understand when they want an early lunch with a friend, then arrive back 15 mins late or ask for changes to the rosters or want a weeks holiday after being with you 2 months ....

Problem#4 Reprimands are often effective - for five minutes! When you've finally had enough and sack them, they act surprised. How could you do this after they granted you the enormous favour of agreeing to work for you?

Anyway in the wash up I'd say the 2 main causes are lack of proper instruction in BASICS and very poor DISCIPLINE. I don't necessarily mean the strap across the bum type (though that would be a useful option to reinstate), rather the order and self-discipline that governed schoolrooms and playgrounds when I, and even my children (aged 26 - 32), were there. (However sent kids to private school with reputation for enforcing behaviourial standards and high levels of scholastic attainment because unimpressed with Public System end products. Money well spent BTW)

My message to Educators and Social Engineers - Prioritise literacy and numeracy. Don't advance children who cannot cope with previous years work. Enforce healthy levels of discipline. Teach realistic expectations of what awaits in the workforce starting with this little mantra; "It's not just about ME"
Posted by divine_msn, Saturday, 17 July 2010 2:19:43 PM
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Otokonoko,

"Year 4 students spend, on average, about 18 per cent of their weekly class time learning mathematics and about five per cent of weekly class time learning science.

The average interest of Australian 15-year-olds in learning science is well below the OECD average and among the lowest in the world. The average level of interest in Queensland is below the level recorded in all of the 41 countries participating in PISA 2006.

In summary, only 44 per cent of Queensland Year 4 teachers report feeling ‘very well’ prepared to teach science. Very few (15-16 per cent) Australian teachers report having had professional development in the teaching and assessment of science. Australian teachers also stand out internationally for their limited use of textbooks (24 per cent do not use a mathematics textbook; 78 per cent do not use a science textbook).

This observation also does not explain why achievement levels in Queensland have flat-lined over the past 15 years while achievement levels in some other states have significantly increased – for example, there has been a significant and sustained improvement in Year 4 mathematics levels in New South Wales and Victoria over this period. There is also evidence of a very recent decline in literacy and numeracy levels in Queensland schools."

http://education.qld.gov.au/mastersreview/pdfs/final-report-masters.pdf

It is difficult to understand how these declines went un-noticed for so long in the education system. I would suggest that these declines were noticed, but ignored, and never mentioned to the public by teachers before they went on strike for their pay rise.

The public is just being used by the education system.

The issue of schools importing almost everything into the class rooms means that it teaches the students to “get it from somewhere else”, but not to produce anything.

Teachers are not producing much at all except excuse making, and eventually the student will do the same.
Posted by vanna, Saturday, 17 July 2010 4:07:36 PM
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