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The Forum > Article Comments > China's debt dragon > Comments

China's debt dragon : Comments

By Arthur Thomas, published 14/7/2010

China has had an historic lack of transparency, misinformation and concealment especially in its banking industry.

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"If China is Plan A for resource exporting countries, what is Plan B?"

There is no Plan B. If this article is correct we're stuffed.
Posted by stevenlmeyer, Wednesday, 14 July 2010 8:52:29 AM
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I have printed out the article to read in detail but I have no doubt that it is at least partially correct.. the official Chinese statistics bear little relation to the reality..
Posted by Curmudgeon, Wednesday, 14 July 2010 5:10:33 PM
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Plan B Goooood Heeeelp,
Did the United Soviet Socialist Republic collapse
or did I just imagine that. The history of the world has been a battle between Kingdoms and has been very costly in human suffering and loss
of life. 2001 years ago a new kingdom was ushered in, the Kingdom of God, With Jesus as the king. Though other kingdoms fail this kingdom lasts for ever. The battle is for the hearts and minds of human beings.
When you are facing tough times you still have choices. Will I believe the word of God, or will I believe the devil. Western civilization prospered when they chose to follow King Jesus, The Word of God, as we move away from his word our civilization is crumbling. China has rightly discerned that the word of God is the difference but wants the kingdom benefits without the King. America has tried to live in Gods presence without holiness and they are going down the tubes. Thank God help is as near as your heart and your tongue for if you confess with mouth and believe in your heart that Jesus is Lord you are saved, then comes the humbling part not my way but your way Lord. If you do what is right and you do it right it works.
Posted by Richie 10, Thursday, 15 July 2010 6:21:27 AM
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I certainly don't claim to be an economist, nor do i have the greatest understanding of economic policy and methodology but it would appear that China has only managed to put off the pain the rest of the world has been feeling. For us it would now seem prudent to get the debt paid off and brace ourselves for round two when the Chinese economy has it's crisis.
What i really don't understand and would be good to have explained is that considering the "boom bust" cycles our economies have been going through ever since and the ever expanding scope of those busts, why do we persist in allowing financial institutions to run massive and unsustainable debt up simply to mask the underlying weakness of the economic system of growth at all costs?

Richie10. Sorry but i thought this was a economic article. What the hell are you on about. Normally i try to be as even handed on this as i can, but considering the complete lack of objectivity in what you say, here it is. What a load of crap. If you were able to understand anything in history you would be well aware that the wonderful people of the kingdom of god are the ones that are responsible for the greater majority of the oppression and suffering of people and its wars. Despite the whole thing being a fairy tale developed as a method of population control. Amazing how you are selective in your views of the godliness of others, the americans are out as i take it are the muslims who claim to be more godly than the christians. As for Jesus being king go and reread your bible and stop being selective in the way you interpret it. either it is a series of stories used to guide or it is literal, either way you are dribbling rubbish.

Sorry to everyone else for the unload, but really.
Posted by nairbe, Thursday, 15 July 2010 7:18:45 AM
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Dear nairbe,
I thought have and have not's was about economics not fairy tales. When truth becomes the fairy tale lack becomes the norm. Jesus said don't cast your pearls before swine. Unless you hunger and thirst for the right way you won't seek or find the way or recognise it. Jesus hid the word in parables to those who rejected him. You do not eat unless you are hungry. In Jesus is found abundance. In mans philosophy is found lack. If you seek truth you find Jesus. If you want true prosperity you only find the true principles in the word of God. When we start following denominations error comes in. Happy seeking.
Regards Richie 10
Posted by Richie 10, Thursday, 15 July 2010 8:20:59 AM
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It seems pointless to me to be casting doubt on China's debt position whilst it is a known fact that the USA position is obviously far more immediate and serious... yet somehow the rest of the world fails to hold it to account.

It's continuing to spend more than it has on wars and luxuries, shows no sign of paying down the debts it has run up all around the world, is fooled by its own greedy finance system that appears outside of government control, and is guided by fraudsters posing as ratings agencies that dare to rate the credit worthiness of others.

If China ends up having debt problems it will be due no doubt to the fact that it foolishly bought lots of what Americans call their "securities", which are evidently worth nothing if America never pays up. It's high time anyone worried about debt unloaded anything they have in the way of American "securities"... cash, bonds, derivatives etc, and invested in things having real productive value.
Posted by Forkes, Thursday, 15 July 2010 4:42:53 PM
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In Australia the Pla B is to tax our smaller Coal and Iron ore Miners on their China based Super Profis while taxing the big miners only on part of their Super Profits.

And the lie continues about how much is expected to be collected.

It's all bs.
And still the borrowing and waste continue.

The three mean bastards Gillard, Swan and Henry should be put on trial for treason.
Posted by keith, Thursday, 15 July 2010 6:29:39 PM
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Keith, Am still trying to get my head around the new deal but the way you are putting it, it would seem to be worse than the original.

The whole China situation has a bigger effect on Australia than America. The Chinese have shown that they can handle a down turn in US consumerism but we certainly cannot deal with a down turn in Chinese hunger for minerals. If China comes off the boil we will really have a depression as our whole economy seems to have become a little too singular in it's focus. Obviously trying to refocus our productivity base over a broader spectrum of areas and trading partners would help ease the issue, but this will take a generation to achieve as well as a big investment in infrastructure and industrial development. None of this will happen because we are now so intent on regaining the surplus and paying off the debt.
Posted by nairbe, Thursday, 15 July 2010 10:16:32 PM
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Dear nairbe,
Having been in one of the food producing industries put to the chop and blowing my health looking for answers for a future for my kids and watching the left wing, political correct agenda of social justice and wealth distribution, I heard a breath of fresh air from the governor of Virginia U.S.A. today on how he turned a $1.2 B budget into surplus in just 8 months. No new lending or taxing scheme, he just did the turtle and lived within his means instead of trying to spend someones else's money as all good politicaly correct left wing socialists do. Most of us have a problem sorting our needs from our wants and living beyond our means for we ignore the word of God. King Solomon a much wiser man than both you & I, said these words "What has been will be again, what has been done will be done again: there is nothing new under the sun". Principles never change, there are no free feeds someone has to pay for them. When we live beyond our means we mortgage our children's future for the debtor is a slave to the lender. Everybody has an idea to skin the cat But the sons and daughters of God are guided by the Holy Spirit. Without relationship you don't know his voice. The only one I fear is God. Lord please help me to hit the target for I know the consequesces of not putting you first. If you awaken and realise our leaders have squandered our future in the name of political correctness I recomend you turn to Jesus the "Word of God" for he is the answer.
Posted by Richie 10, Friday, 16 July 2010 2:34:34 AM
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This is an interesting and informative article. There are economists who say that Chinese economy is incomprehensible.

I have no good knowledge of economics but I think it will be made a little bit eaier, as I feel Mr. Thomas suggested in this, if we introduce the role that the state or the Chinese Communist Party plays in debt problems as in many others. "The logic is simple." It is the logics of politics, not the one of economics since Chinese economy is highly state-controled.
If A owes lots of debts to B in China and A is incapable of paying back, the debts are treated as if non-existen. If B takes to the streets, the state(CCP) resorts to "The ready use of force by the police."

Chinese economy is distorted but its aberratins are made invisible.
Posted by Michi, Tuesday, 20 July 2010 1:21:56 AM
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