pelican,

"In some departments within the public service if you are older and not already in a senior role, older workers are seen as less malleable, less likely to accept the BS, more resistant to change and more likely to speak out against unethical or unfair behaviours."

I will go along with the no BS and oldies are less threanteed by line/middle managers whom may now be at a level that once reported to them. In my long experience Resistence to Change factors are age independent. When bank room computing moved to the user comunity in the 1980s, it was the 20 to 30 somethings that screamed the loudest.

If you look at job adds for the Public Service, it is often the case that SES positions appear to require to have less qualifications than lower managerships; perhaps, to allow political and "favour and grace" appointmentments. Senior people from industry appear to find it hard to switch to the APS, because I suspect, often, the job is already filled.

It might prove interesting to have a practical test, like playing a computer simulation game, to see, who really is the better and more flexible thinker.

*Unfortunately as we age we have no choice I guess but to suck it up and do our best to convince would-be employers that we 'oldies' are a good employment choice*

Not so Pelican. The first time I felt really free, was when I
was self employed and finally had no debts.

Its purely your choice.

Reading some of the replies here reminded me of a program on ageism on Radio National's All in the Mind. Present was Todd Nelson, Associate Professor of Social Psychology at California State University, Stanislaus, who edited a book entitled Ageism: Stereotyping and Prejudice Against Older Persons. Anyhow here are a few thinkers:

"David Rutledge: Todd, people will readily say that ageism is bad, but that it’s not as bad as sexism or racism or homophobia. Which is strange, when you consider that the elderly are just as vulnerable to marginalisation and exploitation as any other social group. Why do you think that people are less concerned about ageism than they are about other -isms?

Todd Nelson: I think the simple answer to that is that ageism is one of the most socially condoned and institutionalised forms of prejudice today..."

and

"David Rutledge: One of the contributors to your book, Todd Nelson, points out that one of the salient differences between ageism and other forms of discrimination is that all the ageists will one day join the outcast group. The white supremacist will never become black, but the ageist will grow old – barring some sort of accident.

Todd Nelson: Yeah, and I think that’s one of the most interesting things. It doesn’t make sense for someone to have and promote negative attitudes toward a group which he or she will eventually join. Most people don’t think about that, maybe they’re living for the moment. But I think also there’s an element of people maybe accepting the stereotypes."

Don't Tell the Kids: An Anatomy of Ageism
http://www.abc.net.au/rn/science/mind/s575028.htm

Yuyusuta,

In IT, high tech is being able to write in machine language, JCL or ADA or write calculus using Fortran. HTML annd Java offer little challange by comparison. Modern software is so very easy to use for someone, who ran a major Commerical Bank or a major Government department on 4 to 16 Meg of memory.

How many twenty olds proficient an Corel draw, could unstring a packed decimal using a base-16 protocol or write a gateway bit protocol between EBCDIC and ASCII or, could write a BASIC A programme to change a font size for a printer output, rather than press a button?

To a 45-50+ year old modern technology is a breeze. After-all they invented it!

Peter Hume,

Not everyone wants to be a big fish in a tiny pound. Between Banking and Academia, I considered buying a Dymocks franchise or a paper shop. Friends said I would go mad. For me, they were right. I thought, "who would to live the mundane existence of the SME entrepreneur"?

More likely older CBD types would still prefer the big league, even if in a lower ranked position. From theer they can still make a worthwhile contribution, while being amused by the crawlers who invited their bosses home for dinner and the thirty year olds who burn the midnight oil, without realising that they will be expendable in the next big downtown.

It's ridiculous when people in their 40s are considered to be past their use by date. In most dealings, as a customer, I would much rather confer with a knowledgeable, patient, mature person than many inexperienced, hard bitten youngsters who often deal the brush off because the enquiry is beyond their expertise.

As a coworker, my best, most helpful and productive team mates have usually been older people. They act as mentors and generally keep the work place calm. I haven't found them to be less progressive than younger workers. If anything it seems to me that their experience means that they adapt faster. In my observation, older people are definitely suffering pointless discrimination.

We do need to make good use of the older person workforce as well as innovative ways of adapting work practices - like greater use of current technology; flexible hours, job sharing and the like. Great service has been sacrificed for bigger profits in so many ways - shop service; telephone call centres; food service; garages and so on - we have automated and self-serve provision and it's much less satisfying than person to person contact.

We not only have an undervalued and useful pool of labour that has the capacity to induct younger workers and mentor them through to give some stability and continuity to service provision; but as a community we will need to provide less for people who can earn their own income. The unemployed worker pool is going to be around for an increasingly long time too - since health conditions obtain better treatment and the life span has increased something like 10 years just in the last 1/2 century.

Where are the bloody unions when we need them?

Yes I think grey power should make it's strength felt in a collective way. Maybe by forming a union. Or as someone suggested, by pooling to create competing businesses

While living in Brisbane a few years ago, I sent an expression of interest to a Sydney university department and was interviewed by phone. Afterwards a representative rang me and said they were extremely impressed by my CV and my interview. They had been looking for ages for someone with my special combination of qualifications and experience – unusual and exactly what they needed. So they wanted to meet me in person & were funding a ticket. In Sydney I walked in to a panel of people all 20 years younger than me; their faces fell as soon as they saw me. They went through the motions but it was obviously a waste of time, and afterwards they told me they could not appoint me because of budget cuts.