All
If we are to move beyond the left/right dichotomy, we must have a better conceptual tool to put in its place.

I humbly commend the following to our readership:
http://www.theadvocates.org/quizp/index.html

Answering the quick quiz leads through to a diagram of much better shema of political opinion, on which we should all be able to agree.

The problem with the left/right range is that it is in one dimension. The above range is in two dimensions: from greater to lesser personal liberty on one axis, and from greater to lesser economic liberty on the other. At least we will then have a clarity which is now lacking under the worse-than-useless 'left/right' dichotomy.

I would be interested to know where people in this thread rate themselves.

I’m pro-choice on everything, so long as people are not aggressing against the person or property of others: libertarian. The problem for libertarians is that we have no acknowledged place on the left/right spectrum. At least socialists *and their opponents* all agree that they belong on the left. But the 'far right' is occupied by Hitler, Mussolini and Franco - totalitarians who are violently opposed to the principles of individual liberty.

On the other hand, libertarians cannot be called middle-of-the-road either, because we are in favour of reducing the size of government by at least 50 percent, and that's not middle of the road. Yet neither are we conservatives like the Republicans, who believe in handouts to industry, government monopoly control of the money supply, overseas military adventures, censorship, and moralistic restrictions of sexual and personal liberty.

Thanks Peter, an interesting quiz. The range of questions is far too small which tends to make the red dot move too dramatically. Can you point to anything that offers a broader range of issues and perspectives?

As an “epicure” I like to avoid any form of limitation in scope or options. As W.C Fields once said, “just looking for loopholes.”

Peter, I think what you said is spot on. i did the test and I was centrist, although i varied amongst the three choices.

I am certainly thankful that Australia is vastly different to the division that exists on many issues in the US, which will indeed complicate its ability to evolve in coming years in a relatively cohesive way.

As you suggest, we need good ideas that will reach out to the common sense people. I am confident that Australian can do it, but it will probably be ideas outside the political parties that inspire change. Politics is too dirty of a game to expect consensus. And with the dud backing down on an ets, I suspect only public anger (if it ever occurs in regards to the environment) will force change, barring an environmental disaster.

But the leadership can be influenced to change. Whether right or wrong, it took many years of pressure to convince govts to reduce industry protectionism. Similarly, with both major parties generally committed to high immigration, public sentiment has moved the Coalition at least to lower its population increase aims.

Peter,
The two-axis quiz is certainly an improvement, but still too limited for me.

What if there was no conflict between the health of society and the health of the economy? Or between the health of the environment and the health of the economy? I think markets should be carefully guided, then businesses left free to work within the guidelines. If the guidelines made it profitable to keep people healthy and to keep the environment healthy (far more plausible than you might at first think), then the economy would propel us rapidly in that direction.

Really, what else would we want an economy to do? Other than work to keep us healthy, and to allow us to seek fulfillment (much more substantial than “happiness”). Other than to ensure our life support system (the natural environment) is thriving around us.

It is a measure of how far we have strayed from common sense (or sanity) that these things would be regarded in conventional political circles as wildly idealistic.

Oh and I’m not looking for Utopia. We would still find plenty to squabble about, it’s the natural state of living things to be in tension between competing and cooperating. But at least we might arrest the rapid and terminal decline we are in now.

And Spindoc I’m talking about much more than global warming, though that is the one that is likely to bring us down soonest, despite your colourful characterisations. You can’t last long depleting your soils, wasting and polluting your water, raising obese and cognitively deprived children, etc. etc.

Paul1405,
Yes the Greens are the best thing around. Take Tony Kevin’s advice, vote 1 (Greens) - 0 (Lab) - 0 (Lib) unless a Green is likely to win -
http://www.eurekastreet.com.au/article.aspx?aeid=20090

Heh - that quiz is spookily accurate for me. Left Liberal, tending to Libertarian/Centrist:

<< LIBERALS usually embrace freedom of choice in personal matters, but tend to support significant government control of the economy. They generally support a government-funded "safety net" to help the disadvantaged, and advocate strict regulation of business. Liberals tend to favor environmental regulations, defend civil liberties and free expression, support government action to promote equality, and tolerate diverse lifestyles. >>

I think I've come across something similar before, but thanks to Peter anyway.

Geoff - I pretty much agree with everything you say in this article. Being a former ALP member who fled to the Greens nearly a decade ago, I also agree with Tony Kevin's advice :)

Yes, the Greens and others are an alternative. Sort of makes a joke about people being concerned about Labor changing over the years. Just vote for another party as many in Britain just did with liberal democrats.

But, if the Greens ever get power, they will also change. It is easy to offer different policies from the sidelines, although they do help temper legislation fortunately from the opportunities created by proportional voting in the Senate.

Look what happened to the Democrats once they sought to become a more middle-of-the-road party. Those looking for difference abandoned them.