>>>Why bring up world peace. What has that to do with this topic?

You said Christianity has failed to bring harmony to humanity, which isn't the point. If every single person were a Christian who was truly saved, there would be a lot more harmony than there is today. The commands that Jesus gave us to live by would bring peace to the Earth in some manner, if everyone followed them. When Jesus returns, there will be harmony, but not until then.

>>>I don’t consider I am depraved.

How many times do you think you've broken the ten commandments? Have you ever lied, cheated, stolen, looked with lust, had sex outside of marriage, hated anyone, coveted anything, put anything before God? Give me an estimate.

>>>Are you North American?

It is neither my website, nor did I plagiarize from it. It is most likely an idea which has circulated through the Christian community. I myself heard it from a Pastor named Adrian Rogers. Yes, I am American which is why I spell it "skeptic".

You have asked for proof that Jesus is God but you won't respond to how you get that proof. Why is that? God works by personal revelation, which means that you're not going to know anything about God unless He reveals Himself to you. Would you be willing to pray this and read the book of John?:

God, I don't know if you exist or not. I don't know if the bible is your word or not. I don't know if Jesus Christ is your Son or not, but I want to know, and because I want to know I will make an honest investigation, and because it is an honest investigation I will follow the results of that investigation where ever they lead me, regardless of the cost. If the bible s your word, show me. I'll make up my mind before the fact that I will obey you only if you show me this is your word and speak to my heart.

If not, why not?

David,

>>>no matter the crime, should be tortured forever. What an utterly >>>repulsive idea.

As I explained earlier, you don't go to hell for your unbelief, you go to hell for your sins. It's your unbelief which keeps you from receiving forgiveness. Yes, I do care you are headed to hell which is why I am telling you how to receive forgiveness and be saved. No one who ends up in hell will get there because they were ignorant. Gods word says you don't have any excuse. You don't want to obey God so why should you escape the consequences?

Let me ask you about your ethical standards. Why is it wrong for someone to be tortured forever?

>>>Genetics and nurture do not work in an exact manner.

I don't follow the posts here, in fact this thread is my only exposure to your website. So what is your background?

I am Christian only because God gave me personal revelation. I would never have become a Christian otherwise. I didn't read the bible and think it sounded plausible; it's that God confirmed His word to me as being true and accurate.

>>>all happened in your head?

When I gave my life to Jesus Christ, He supernaturally transformed me in a split second. It happened during my baptism. When I went into the water I was one person, and when I came out I was a different person. The person who went into the water was filled with darkness, and the person who came out of the water was filled with light. Where there was sadness, God placed joy. Where there was hate, God placed love. Where there was anger, God placed compassion. Where there was addiction, God placed contentment. Where there was anxiety, God placed peace. This all happened in a moments time. What the scripture says is that in baptism we are buried with Jesus in His death when we immerse ourselves, and then we are raised to life as new person coming out of the water in symbology to His resurrection. God made me brand new.

washed,

I am not on a crusade to bring world peace although things would be a lot more peaceful if religion exited as religions show no sign of getting along in a majority. However, as I am the president of the Atheist Foundation of Australia, it is my job to educate Australians to keep specific indoctrination of religion away from Australian children and out of Australian politics. If other countries did similar, world-peace may be possible.

I have no desire to lie, cheat and steal. I am as lustful as human nature allows and my sex life is personal. I do not hate anyone, nor have I coveted my neighbour’s ox or ass. I don’t recognise your god to be able to put anything before it. Have you coveted your neighbour’s ox or ass?

Oh, a case of ….. minds think alike!

It doesn't matter what a god does to me or thinks of me. The point is you go along with a monstrous idea and then have the gall to call it a god of love. I would not obey a god that displays such abysmal ethical behaviour even if it did exist. If it threatened me with hell for eternity I’d lie to him then. I don’t approve of tyrannical dictators.

You come from America and deny indoctrination. That is the most religious and dysfunctional democracy on the planet. I see why you said you were raised in a secular household. Atheism is a real no, no in the States. Even the mention of the name could have adverse ramifications. Explain your upbringing? Were you taught about all religion and none? What information was supplied showing the harms inherent in religion? Were you given a wide knowledge base? Do you accept the theory of evolution or believe in creationism? Old/young earth?

More bible nonsense and prayers will not affect me one iota. You have been told they are magic words but that is a fib.

Yes, you say you have had a personal revelation. Great and good for you, but others haven’t.

David

washed,

I didn't have enough words remaining to say, >>Great, but other haven’t – and seeing how the religious mindset is so blinkered and knowing the damage such thinking causes on a national and a planetary scale, others don’t want one. Why would they? Most religions offer the same kind of revelatory experience for their various imaginary gods. Yours is also imaginary unless you can supply proof it is not.If you go back to the bible, you end our discussion as I will take that as there is no hope for you.<<

Some people gain comfort from religion and if so that is fine. But it is not fine to interfere with the minds of children with any subjective idea as though it is some kind of truth, especially utilising threats about hell and promises of eternal life as you obviously have fallen prey to.

David

OzSpen,

“That is changing, as the demographics demonstrate.”

It might be changing but with only a combination of nine hundred thousand in 22 million, you would have to be very optimistic for big change anytime in the future. Be a while before you catch up to no religion and not stated at around 7 million and growing rapidly. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Australia#Other

David

David,

<<It might be changing but with only a combination of nine hundred thousand in 22 million, you would have to be very optimistic for big change anytime in the future. Be a while before you catch up to no religion and not stated at around 7 million and growing rapidly. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Australia#Other>>

Large numbers do not determine who are in God's kingdom.

Jesus said: 'For many are called, but few are chosen' (Matthew 22:14).

OzSpen,

I've been naughty and not nice and Santa will be cross next year. I used figures for the Pentecostal and Baptist count to see if you really do know what you are talking about and as astute as you make out.

Obviously you don't and aren't.

The combination is not 900 thousand out of 22 million, the real figure is under 600 thousand. My advice, check all facts, even mine.

Or, did you know and thought why not leave the false figure stand. :))

David