"As others have pointed out the bible contains verses suggesting the killing of people which I would hope the law would involve itself in if someone was preaching from those verses and inciting others to follow them. I would suggest that the same should apply to the Quran."

These acts cannot be performed legally of course despite the text of the holy books of both religions suggest that this killing should be done. So there is freedom to believe whatever you want, but the freedom to act out these beliefs is not extended to the point where it conflcits with the law of the land. Sanity prevails to prevent the fundamentalist lunatics from acting out their fantasies.

So if you want to perform killing in the name of your favourite relgion, make sure you restrict it be carried out on Highway 61.

Now that it seems a consensus has been agreed and I wont be highjacking, I have a question to ask. It has been puzzling me for ages actually. I have seen on many threads regarding religion that the terms "humanist" and "secular humanism" are reserved for the greatest of villification and, apparently, applied to the worst enemies of society and/or religion.

Have I missed something? Is there a new branch of - oh I dunno - devil-worshippers or anarchists who have started using this term? Just as the philosophies of the Stoics and the Epicureans have given their name to somewhat twisted versions of what they stand for, has the same happened to the Humanists? Is there now another meaning which differs from the traditional?

After all, thousands of Christians in America proudly reiterate the words of the most famous Humanist of all, John Locke, each time they recite "All men are created equal..." and seem not to have any qualms about it. Why, in this forum, is the word used to denigrate? Could someone "please explain"?

Dear Romany,

Words can be twisted and interpreted to mean whatever a 'writer' pleases. But that does not mean that the meaning is accurate, logical, or even (dare I say it) sane.

Some people use words as a weapon to attack things they don't agree with.

To me humanism is a way of looking at our world which emphasizes the importance of human beings - their nature and their place in the universe. As the Latin writer Terence said more than 2,000 years ago, "I am a man, and nothing human is foreign to me."
Humanism teaches that every person has dignity and worth and therefore should command the respect of every other person.

Obviously some posters on this forum - don't agree and place their own interpretation on the word.

The numerical superiority of the views expressed here adds no credance to their truth, for thousands of years most thought the earth was flat too, didn't make them right though. I object to the constant assumption that a follower of Christ has been brainwashed as a child, maybe it makes you feel better, but it is very far from the truth. After graduating from the UNSW in History and Law I researched the claims and truth of both Christ and the bible from an historical and scientific perspective and found the evidence supporting the claims to be overwhelmingly supported, certainly no one brain washed me as a child. If you want to argue with the definition of 'religion' I gave argue with Websters.. If humanism is about the integrity of human life why are so many humanists pro-abortion, or is an unborn life not human according to humanism?

I take objection to this comment

You are free to follow your religious beliefs much as you please, just not free to inflict them on me

So you are free to inflict your, by the definition I originally gave, religious set of views and values on me? Every day I am afflicted by those that hold the view that this life is it, that want to impose their own standard of morality or should I say lack of of morality on others. Just like anyone else, if you don't want to hear someone talking to you about their beliefs whether christianity or not, then walk away, you don;'t legislate against it otherwise everyone would need to keep their opinion to themselves, because it might affect someones right to be inflicted by anothers beliefs...If I want to share with someone my faith, I should be free to do it, if they don't want to participate I am not holding a gun to their head (unlike Islam)...

Just to clarify, the way a christian views secular humanism is pretty much a relativistic interpretation, the view that there is nothing absolute, and that all meaning and standards are relative based on your own culture, point of view or just what feels right, rather than a set of absolute moral standards that are immutable and unchangeable, not altered by culture, history or personal background, it is acknowledging that there is an absolute truth as given by a divine creator who established those standards for our own good. We have some classic outcomes of this type of society in Stalins Russia and Nazi Germany, both atheistic and relativistic socieities that expounded heavily Darwins, survival of the fittest as justification for expunging millions of 'inferior' lives..