Daggett
We are not racist. We actually work with Muslim Leaders and have done for years. As far as I know we are the only group outside their own projects to do so. We are in the process of changing those we work with but other than that nothing has changed.
We work to re open abattoirs and we are trying to get skilled meat workers in Halal slaughter into the country to train Aboriginal people and people in regional areas.

Not just working on the chain in slaughter but in the many different employment oportunitys it brings.
We said right from the start we support bringing in skilled workers but only in the areas in which they are required and not to flood the cities and our unis taking the uni positions and IT jobs from our own kids.
I would have thought that were pretty clear to everybody.

Nor did we say any of the people given PR in this country were recieving more just questioning should we not be looking after our own first.
There are many people arriving here who have debiltating health problems and we do have people born here that are unable to recieve the same level of assistance that they do.
Hense I mentioned the lady John Laws was speaking to on talk back radio last week.
These poor elderly couple are trying to pay thousands for medication for the daughter each month.
They can not get the same level of assistance that aparrently John Laws said was being given by a person who had just arrived in the country. The Government is paying in contrast for the medication for the new arrival while the elderly Aussies are forced to sell their house.
Thats wrong pure and simple.
The Government must get the balance right.
Sure bring in skilled workers there is nobody who supports it more than us but only in the areas we need them. Not to take jobs from our own IT kids or areas where Australian kids are missing out in prefernce to overseas kids.

Daggett, read up a little as to what happened around the world.
China, USSR, Eastern Europe, Cuba, North Korea, all countries
where Govts planned and ran virtually all industries. How
many of those industries did not collapse in the end?

Telstra did ok, as it had consumers over a barrel. It could screw
them for every cent with impunity. As with all large monopolies,
complacency sets in, nobody needs to be efficient.

If it was technology that made Telstra charge 6$ and 9$ an hour
for internet access, why was net access so much cheaper in the
US and Canada at the same time? I actually spent a great deal
of time back then, trying to convince some politicians and Telstra
people, of the potential benefits of the internet if charges were
reasonable, pointing out the fact that it cost Telstra no more
if a line was being used or not, unlike say electricity.

Its a sad fact of life, that big, fat, lazy monopolies tend to
screw consumers, rather then work in their best interests. So
was the case with Telstra.

Fester, I heard an interesting suggestion from a WA company who are
moving some of their ferry building to Singapore, due to lack
of staff here.

They suggested tying 457s to companies who are prepared to train
apprentices in Australia. That makes sense to me, as we still
urgently need more companies prepared to train young people

The aboriginal people and Elders want those jobs. They have asked to meet with reps. There are some working on it now. They say they do want to work. Its just totally untrue that all aboriginal people dont want to work. There is a large majority of them who do. Many would like to own their own farms and plants as well. Sure lots of them have land but no means to add to it and less contacts with overseas investors.
Austrade need to be putting on a few seminars in those places and bring invesorts into Australia instead of mark vaile running around flogging ships of live sheep to Kwaite.
Dagett
On the meat trade side Yabbys is correct. We do need the workers approved to come into regional but i stand right behind you on the IT and city places one hundred percent

Yabby,

Have you yet exhausted your repertoire of ploys to divert attention away from the serious flaw in your case?

I guess, if you think about it, if the answer to any challenge to free market policies is simply to raise the examples of China, USSR, Eastern Europe, Cuba, North Korea etc (and BTW Cuba actually has a lot going for it IMHO anyway, but that is an other argument), there is really little left to discuss is there?

You asserted that Telstra collapsed as a result of deregulation. I showed that this was nonsense and you have still failed to respond to my point.

As to comparisons between comparative charges for Internet access between Canada and the US on the one hand and Australia on the other hand all those years ago, I can't comment a great deal. However, it is also the case that with years of deregulation and privatisation, that the cost of broadband in this country is still far greater than equivalent broadband services overseas.

Also it has been said that Telstra did very well to have provided all the services services that it did to the whole of this continent with its relatively small and sparsely spread population, but I wouldn't expect a right wing ideologue with a barrow to push to acknowledge that, now would I?

Of course, Telstra was not perfect back then, but I hold that the solution was to abolish its corporate money-gouging charter which drove many of its poorer policy decisions and have made it a public service once again. Handing it over lock, stock and barrel to Trujillo and his management team, imported from the US, has made matters vastly worse.

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People Against Live Exports and Intensive Farming.

Thanks. I appreciate the points you are making. I can see that your case has merit, even though, as a general rule, we both object to the massive increase in the importation skilled or unskilled workers into this country.

I commend you for your perseverence.

"Fester, I heard an interesting suggestion from a WA company who are
moving some of their ferry building to Singapore, due to lack
of staff here."

Good idea, Yabby, if the shortage is bad enough. But it needs to be carefully scrutinised to avoid abuses. Rightly or wrongly, the public perception has been that there has not been enough scrutiny.

Russia will be an interesting country to compare with Australia: It should be of interest to see whether a declining population coupled with the wealth from a resources boom brings greater living standard improvements than Australia.

"Daggett, Govt planned economies have failed everywhere, including
here. If an industry collapsed when it was deregulated, then
clearly there was not much substance behind it in the first place,
maybe just propped up by tariffs. Thats a cost to other industries."

Thats what I actually wrote. In that snip I never actually
mentioned Telstra collapsing, you jumped to that conclusion.

Fact is however that in the end the old economic model of
Telstra screwing customers blind, to make huge fat profits,
was not politically acceptable anymore, so it had to end.

Frank Blount, an American, ran Telstra in those days. IMHO
Telstra is still badly managed, but then I'm not on the
board. At least now I can choose to sell my shares and choose
another carrier. Main thing is conumsers benefit from much
much lower charges!

I remind you that Canada is a great big country, with far
more problems when it comes to laying cables, then Australia.
Snow and ice for a start, over virtually the whole country.

Thats the problem with big, fat , lazy monopolies. There is
no need for them to change. Sad but true. Thats why Govts
are such failures at providing efficient services