Hi Romany

You said "One thing that the writer of this piece did not mention is the huge change that came about when the Chinese Government finally broke the silence and prohibitions of mention surrounding this event and brought it into the public forum. That was huge."

Hmmm...please lift your hands from the keyboard...have a think...look around...leave the alternative Party universe...and enter the zone of individual thought not governed by the Party.

Difficult, I recognise.

Now please watch this short clip http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-3DHqom5DUQ

and especially this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crJp0L2qzWQ

I appreciate your loyalty to mainland China, but the Communist Party is just a cruel new dynasty in China's long histry. There will be new, better dynasties or even democratic governments.

Maybe one day, even the current Dynasty, will allow the Chinese people to speak for themselves, outside Party lines. Those Chinese who know a little about Tiananmen are aware of the fate of many who speak.

I recommend you watch the short clips above.

Regards

Peter Coates

Dear Romany,

I'm also surprised at the picture you paint
of what the Government in China is allowing
the Chinese people to do regarding the
anniversary of Tiananmen Square.

We're getting quite the opposite view on our
news programs here. There was actual footage
taken by journalists in Tiananmen
Square who as we saw on camera - were being
prevented from even so much as filming the
Square by Chinese secret police - intruding
in front of the TV cameras with huge umbrellas
to prevent anything being filmed or seen on
camera.

News reports from Reuters and CNN and other
news sources tell us that Internet sites are
also being blocked as are TV programs that even
mention Tiananmen Square. There is also a very strict
ban on journalists and news media in general.

This paints a very different picture
from the one you're presenting.

…………………………continued from previous post (excerpted from Howard Zinns- Cross-examining American Ideology.)

SIMILARITIES between the SUPPRESSION Of the Tiananmen Square incident by the Chinese and the lack of record in American history books of The Ludlow Massacre, continued………………

<As I read about this I wondered why this extraordinary event , so full of drama ,so peopled by remarkable personalities was never mentioned in the American history books I was studying.
A close look at the Colorado strike would reveal that not only the state Government of Colorado but the National Government in Washington, was on the side of the Corporations. While miners were being beaten, jailed and killed by Rockefeller’s Detectives or by the National Guard the federal Government did nothing to protect the constitutional right of it’s people.

I concluded that a certain unspoken understanding lay beneath the writing of textbooks and the teaching of history : that it would be considered, bold,radical , even “communist” to emphasize class struggle in the United States, a country where the dominant ideology emphasized the oneness of the Nation e.g. “We the People, in order to ……etc….etc.

Pete Plantagenet,

Why on earth should I have "loyalty" to mainland China? And what was the idea which fuelled this? : -

"Hmmm...please lift your hands from the keyboard...have a think...look around...leave the alternative Party universe...and enter the zone of individual thought not governed by the Party.

Difficult, I recognise."

An inference that I don’t have individual thought? That I’m divorced from reality? That thought is difficult for me? That I’m influenced by the Chinese government?

What have I ever posted that would give rise to these ideas?

I get rather tired, when trying to introduce some objectivity into any subject, of being accused of partisanship. Though I do recognise the irony in standing accused of bias when my purpose is to introduce some balance.

Is the purpose of your put-downs to say that China has NOT lifted the ban on discussion of Tiananmen? Or that it’s NOT progress for a totalitarian regime to open public dialogue on Tiananmen? Or do you, perhaps, simply disagree with any posts that seek to point to the fact that change has been and is going on all the time?

Foxy,

Yeah, I can quite understand how you would be surprised to learn the extent of change. Certainly Western media seem loath ever to report on the more heartening news from China. Judging from many of the responses on these and other threads, people like their enemies all black and their heroines all white and the propaganda machine obligingly continues to churn out these stereotypes.

I, in turn, was very surprised to read the thread of the Indian demo. That, so far , deals with racism in the community. Whereas in overseas publications it is presented solely as an indictment of the Austrlalian police, who are called thugs and louts.

I remain staunchly a-political and all the Governments of the world can go to hell in a handbasket for mine.I’m just saying give ‘e fair go.