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The Forum > General Discussion > Capitalism

Capitalism

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Belly,
Supposing a country got all the revenue it needed from land tax, why should it be obliged to tax profits as well?

And your plan seems to involve businesses paying taxes on their costs as well as their profits, which would greatly harm our competitiveness.
_____________________________________________________________________________________

individual,
>Who said profit is pure ?
That'd be you!
Of course you didn't say ALL profit is pure, but nor did I.

And I notice you've conveniently avoided my first question: 10% of what?

>Pure profit means the profit that is after all expenses have been covered including wages.
>We should have a set general wage amount & if those who want more can work extra as much
>as they like but as Belly says, no loopholes such as negative gearing or tax bracketing.
Looks like you haven't considered the devastating effect on small business.

>That would make us an enviable society within a very short time. the same tax on everything & not
>like 70% on fuel/cigarettes etc. Every article sold attracts 10% full stop. Inheritance included.
So you'd be happy to effectively encourage teens to smoke? And do nothing to deter and recover the cost of air pollution?
Posted by Aidan, Thursday, 25 April 2019 9:04:31 PM
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Aidan,
too bad you don't click !
Posted by individual, Thursday, 25 April 2019 11:25:33 PM
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitalism

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_law

Capitalism is a form of Universal Natural Law and can lead to Globalism- it puts decisions under control of the financial markets. The financial markets are a powerful way to manage some complex problems- I can see in some circumstances they could be used more- but they are a tool- whether a tool is useful depends on what one wants to achieve. As our societies change we need to use tools to manage the societies- sometimes we need to invent new ones or preferably use old tools in new ways. I believe that universalism will lead to inequality and tyranny especially when it is implemented on a global scale- despite Locke's intentions. Locke apparently saw governing as being like organised crime or oligarchy (probably based on Aristotle's Politics) and felt that universalist Liberal Democracy was a way of avoiding this trap- Patrick Deneen/ Alexis de Tocqueville's contention is that Liberal Democracy ends up the same way though at a larger scale. Patrick Deneen says that it was Locke's intention with Liberalism Economic (Capitalism) and Social Liberalism is to create universal conditions to enable humanity to be "free of government". A large effort would be required to create these conditions but less effort to maintain it. But Liberal Democracy is in fact more overbearing than intended- constant corrections need to be made to the system to make it function.

Adam Smith talked of the unseen hand- universalist economics- but he was appalled at stock piling and price gouging of tobacco before and during the US War Of Independence.

Globalisation seems to contradict the principles of the UN principle of self determination (ironically the UN seems to be pushing globalization), and the US Declaration of Independence- Government of the people (though ironically inspired by Locke). At some stage there is always a compromise of principles- myself I favour self determination over universalism.
Posted by Canem Malum, Thursday, 25 April 2019 11:50:44 PM
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In the practical art of war, the best thing of all is to take the enemy's country whole and intact; to shatter and destroy it is not so good. So, too, it is better to recapture an army entire than to destroy it, to capture a regiment, a detachment or a company entire than to destroy them. Sun Tzu- Art of War

The way I interpret this is- forming a team or an organisation is a difficult task taking lots of resources- this team can be applied to tasks and achieve goals. It's important not to waste this resource without reason. Nations are similar engines of productivity in the service of their cultures. Why would someone want to change the culture of a nation by force.
Posted by Canem Malum, Thursday, 25 April 2019 11:51:29 PM
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Hey individual,
"No-one should be allowed to make more than 10% pure profit".
Well it wouldn't be capitalism then.
Not sure what I'd be, but it wouldn't be Capitalism.

You've got to see both sides;
You might think it unfair that some charge a huge markup;
(And I know that prices these days often raise an eyebrow)
But know that under Capitalism, you have the opportunity to not only be a retail customer but a business owner yourself.

If you can identify areas or items with large markup and little competition you too could start a business with lower profit margins and better value for customers.

It's my belief that if you 'provide a good quality product' at a 'value for money' price, then your product should sell itself.

There are some problems, and flaws that I can see with your idea though.
[FYI I actually thought of the same thing once, only I was thinking Cost + 20%]

It's flawed because it does not allow for 'supply and demand' to itself determine the products value.

Say you buy 200 mobile phones and begin selling at cost + 10.
What happens if a mobile phone competitor brings out a better model cheaper and then your items aren't selling?
What happens when a new model of phone supersedes the stock you currently have?
Do you sell at less than 'Cost + 10' to get rid of the old stock;
Are you happy to sell at a potential loss;
or do you be prideful and not sell at all?

If you can provide me a better price on items I WANT with the same level of service I'm used to getting:
- Then you've got my money, I'll buy from you -
Posted by Armchair Critic, Friday, 26 April 2019 2:17:53 AM
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Hey Belly, Aiden and Foxy,
Belly Quote>>It needs growth in population profits productivity<<

Aiden Quote>>Actually it doesn't. It works whether population is growing, steady or declining.
I'd argue it can work even when profits aren't growing.<<

- I think Capitalism and Servicing National Debt are two different things.

Capitalism can work whether population is growing, steady or declining;
But historically no nation has come back from a fertility rate less than 1.8
Servicing National debt however does require growth I believe, because money is lent into existence (with interest due) instead of being spent into existence by the government.

Foxy Quote>>Our economy is controlled primarily by the market.<<
I'm not sure that's exactly true, for the same reason Aiden mentioned.

Reserve Banks can manipulate the market by modifying the interest rate to slow or stimulate lending and spending, which affects the amount of new constructions and the employment they require, and underpins the economy so it's not really the market determining prices any more than the cost of buying money (borrowing)
Posted by Armchair Critic, Friday, 26 April 2019 2:39:43 AM
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