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The Forum > General Discussion > Has the term feminism run its course?

Has the term feminism run its course?

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Julie Bishop doesn't find it useful to describe herself as a feminist http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/im-no-feminist-julie-bishop-20141029-11dn7m.html. I can understand that. Because of its more radical proponents, feminism means something in the common mind that is not helpful to ensuring equality for women.

I have two daughters, both studying at university, and I hope that their careers are no worse than their brother's, and they seem to be setting themselves up to achieve that. But neither describe as feminists. In fact, none of the young women that I regularly mix with describe themselves as feminists.

I have male friends of my own age or older who self-describe as feminists. Not something I have been tempted to do, even though I've always been keen to promote female equality and my first boss was a woman - Senator Kathy Martin.

For me the reason is that I'm uneasy with a term which seems to favour one gender over the other. And I also see situations in which feminism has led as much to the unfair detriment of boys as to the reasonable benefit of girls.

Yes, there has been a boys club in the past, but I don't think you fix that by creating a rival girls club.

Gender is just one of the attributes we are born with. Surely the aim of feminism is to ensure that it is just one, and you can't do that by defining everything in terms of that attribute.

So we'll know feminism has succeeded when the term falls into disuse. Perhaps Julie Bishop has recognised its success before some of her female colleagues?
Posted by GrahamY, Sunday, 2 November 2014 6:00:54 PM
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Dear Graham,

I've always regarded feminism as a belief
in equality and justice for all. What could be more
important than that. It is still relevant today
especially regarding Julie Bishop's recent comments.

A reader made this observation in The Age,
Saturday, November 1, 2014:

"Foreign Minister Julie Bishop has confused me, again.
She said that she does not acknowledge the existence
of a glass ceiling, yet goes on to say she does
"the very best I can to make it easier for those who will
follow me." (The Age, 30/10)."

"But if there is no glass ceiling why does it need to
be easier? ..."
Posted by Foxy, Sunday, 2 November 2014 9:36:10 PM
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No problems translating what Bishop said. She has never accepted the glass ceiling as an excuse for not getting the job she is after. She's not saying it doesn't exist, but that talking about it doesn't help. You just need to try again.
Posted by GrahamY, Sunday, 2 November 2014 9:46:29 PM
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Foxy,
If you believe in equality you're not a Feminist, that makes you a liberal like Julie Bishop and she merely expressed an altruistic sentiment in the section you've quoted. Odds are her successor will be a man, if she has a protege on her staff I bet he's a man also, she's just saying she'll do her best to pass on her experience and make the climb up the ladder a bit easier for the next generation.
There's a stark difference between what people think Feminism means and what it looks like in practice, it's basically two irreconcilable views.
I'm a White Nationalist, we're very quick to say who should and should not be heard, whose views are out of date, divisive or just plain wrong, this is a way of thinking common to most real world schools of thought. This introspection is something which until the last few years has been absent from Feminism and it's only come about because thanks to the internet Feminism is now something inextricably linked with the worst kind of degenerates, hucksters and kooks.
This is how bad it's become and this is why people are angry:
http://www.womanist-musings.com/2011/03/stop-denying-white-female-privilege.html
http://i1.wp.com/therightstuff.biz/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/white.jpg

Maybe if in the 1970's "Feminists" had simply said that people like Andrea Dworkin, Susan Sontag and Susan Brownmiller and the dozens of other aesthetically challenged Jewesses who didn't get prom invites should no longer be heard because their views were divisive, motivated by personal bias and just flat out wrong women's activism might have retained some of the credibility it had built up in the early 20th century.
The Feminist motto "Make the personal political" is the exact opposite of what the West represents, it's, shall we say an oriental way of thinking for an oriental people.
Posted by Jay Of Melbourne, Sunday, 2 November 2014 10:19:55 PM
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I was reading about this very subject in the guardian yesterday.
It shows a different perspective on the subject.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/nov/01/julie-bishop-doesnt-find-feminism-useful-what-do-rightwing-women-want-anyway?view=mobile

Julie Bishop has to tow the party line of a very conservative, very Catholic Prime Minister. Feminism is a dirty word to him and his band of merry men, no matter how many daughters troop dutifully out to show us they feel women are 'equal'.

Julie Bishop and her other right-wing female colleagues apparently all feel the same about feminism (not surprising). They feel it has had it's day and that us women are competing with the men equally now.
But are we?

"Joining their chorus, Concetta Fierravanti-Wells concurred with Scott’s comments that jobs should be awarded based on “merit and ability to do the job”.
Bishop is the Abbott government’s only female cabinet member; the most optimistic conclusion to draw from Scott and Fierravanti-Wells’ comments is that the women who are drawn to involvement in the LNP lack merit and ability, or they’d rise higher. The pessimistic view is that right-wing men are somehow inherently superior to right-wing women, which is why they proliferate at female expense."

Indeed.

It is well known out here in the wider community that Bishop runs rings around Abbott as far as speaking in public and diplomatic relations with other countries goes.

Will she ever get the top job though?
Not a hope in hell...
Posted by Suseonline, Monday, 3 November 2014 12:51:39 AM
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I have to agree with the girls here, Bishop has benefited from the past efforts of women as they have fought for equality, which incidentally they are yet to fully achieve. That does not make them any different to many others within society, who are also yet to achieve that full equality that they so richly deserve. Now that Bishop has personally achieved much, and she has, the woman feels its not necessary to carry on the fight for her sisters, not that she was in the fight in the first place, I suspect she has simply been a beneficiary of the efforts of others. In other words "I'm all right Jackie, stuff you!" but put in nice terms, a very selfish attitude indeed.
I know a number of women who I could easily describe as active feminists, but they are not all the same, they all have personalities which very much come into play. Two women who are MP's and very active for women, are two totally different people, one the out there, in your face noisy type, the other a far more relaxed lay back quite type of person. Both these women are educated knowledgeable and articulate, but from very different backgrounds, but both are passionate about women's issues and other issues as well. Which one is the better feminists? I find them both equal.
I asked my partner "T" last night if she considered herself a feminists. She said "Yes I am, I'm a human being first, a Maori second and a women third, and all three are telling you to do the washing up, NOW!" "Yes dear, straight away dear, sorry dear, should equality apply to doing the dishes?" LOL
Posted by Paul1405, Monday, 3 November 2014 7:12:58 AM
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