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The Forum > Article Comments > Gunns and the democratic ritual > Comments

Gunns and the democratic ritual : Comments

By Peter Henning, published 6/3/2008

We have a culture where those who put their moral convictions above loyalty to party are exposed to ostracism and abuse.

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It appears that the author of this article has ignored the recent federal election, just like the couple of hundred die hard opponents to the mill did last week when their protest included the street theatre of coffins claiming democracy is dead.
Well just have a look at the November Federal Election where the 'Demos' (the People) had the opportunity to decide on the pulp mill. In his national advertising campaign, Bob Brown said: “Vote Labor or Liberal and you vote for the pulp mill!”
Well, Australians did in their millions!
In fact over 10 and a half million Australians did or about 85% per cent of electors gave their first preference vote to the Labor or Coalition parties.
National voting results for the House of Representatives were
Labor and Coalition: 10,576,807 (85.16%)
Green 967,781 (7.79%)
Only the author and the greens refuse to accept the umpire's (in this case the people) decision.
Posted by cinders, Monday, 17 March 2008 2:00:43 PM
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David you are genuinely misguided if you believe clearfelling Mountain Ash wet schlerophyll forest then firebombing the leftovers and poisoning the native animals is 'sustainable'. Then woodchip the magnificent timber and export it to Japan. All done with industrial machinery. Do you have any idea of ecology or are you just talking for the sake of it?

The comment earlier on Tasmania being too peaceful is a little short of the mark, i fear. Tasmanians are Australians, and Australians are comfortable and rich. And conservative. Because why would we want to come down off this consumerism trip to bite the hand that feeds us? Injustice and inequality will continue so long as we continue to support this ridiculous 'democracy' that lets one person be more powerful than another, all the way to the top of the political and corporate pyramid/s.
Posted by The Mule, Saturday, 29 March 2008 6:31:02 PM
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If you don't "firebomb the leftovers" then you will not get any regeneration, as seems to have happened on Bruny Island, where there were once stands of magnificent timber, but now only trash. This is not the case with the forest south of Hobart, where good stands of timber are now growing in areas which were logged about ninety years ago.

I will certainly agree that good timber should not be turned into woodchip. That should be left to old growth forest which is only going to die anyway and has little if any millable timber present.

David
Posted by VK3AUU, Saturday, 29 March 2008 8:34:43 PM
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Hi David

Yes i understand that Eucalyptus regnans does not regenerate without fire but do you know what fire does to all the other life that is(was) living in that forest? Dead. Also contributes to further nutrient mobilisation from erosion. Also massive amounts of carbon released directly to atmosphere contributing to air pollution. The difference between this and natural fire regimes is that it might be 500 years between fires in wet schlerophyll, and when it does happen all of the existing biomass remains on site, as it is. Trees remain as shelters for animals. The soil is not churned and mobilised from industrial machinery. Much more life remains after a fire if it is not first raped by massive machinery.

A 'regenerated' forest after clearfell and napalm is far less biodiverse.

I am glad you oppose woodchipping. Quality timber can be obtained from managed plantation, it is not that hard. paper can be obtained from plantation timber and crops. Old-growth logging is a cheap-land grab, they pay next to nothing for this state forest and then reap the rewards from 'plantation' or 'sustainable' timber in the years to follow.
Posted by The Mule, Friday, 4 April 2008 8:27:14 PM
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I suggest you read

http://www.fiatas.com.au/index.php?id=11

Although I don't think it was specifically mentioned, the area of the coops logged at any one time is comparatively small so that when the regeneration burns are carried out, there is ample opportunity for wild life to move to adjacent safe areas. This does not occur in wildfire situations.

David.
Posted by VK3AUU, Friday, 4 April 2008 10:05:39 PM
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Mule

Contrary to your assertions, fire does not discriminate on whether a European or God has lit the fire. High intensity regeneration burns lit by foresters occur over a much smaller area than uncontrolled wildfires which you claim are "natural". This means that erosion can be much higher as well as the release of carbon. The longer the absence of fire, the higher the fuel levels. The higher the fuel levels the hotter the burn. The hotter the burn, the greater the release of nutirents, particularly nitrogen. If it is uncontrolled then the chances of a very intense burn over a much larger area is much greater.

Your claim that biomass remains on-site after the first wildfire in 500 years is impossible. In the wet forests anywhere near that age, you cannot get a low intensity fire when the understorey is made up of mesic species and/or a rainforest. The only fire that can occur is a very high intensity crown fire under severe fire weather. Under these conditions, all the biomass is removed and the forest has an opportunity to rejuvenate itself back to a eucalypt forest without the rainforest understorey. In the absence of fire the eucalypts disappear and rainforest takes over. This is part of the constant war between ecotones where one type tries to dominate the other (in this case eucalypt vs rainforest). The main agent for change is fire or the lack of it. Since lightning isn't an ignition source in southern Tasmania, the hand of man (as well as climate) has played a big role the distribution of both wet eucalypt forest and rainforests for millenia....(cont'd)
Posted by tragedy, Saturday, 5 April 2008 12:44:32 PM
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