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The Forum > Article Comments > Fact rather than fable in the Iraq debate > Comments

Fact rather than fable in the Iraq debate : Comments

By Ted Lapkin, published 31/10/2006

The study that claims there have been 655,000 civilian Iraqi deaths is the deployment of pseudo-science in a bald-faced campaign to sway America’s choice of leadership.

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As for your latest blather it is so full of inconsistencies, even of your own half-arguments, that i am not even going to give them the courtesy of a response other than this.

(Nope. He's so dumb he won't be able to begin to know where to start unless it is pointed out to him....)

The UN solved East Timor! (a former Muslim Colony of the largest Muslim nation on Earth, 200 million of em compared to Austrlia's 20 mil) - Peacefully! without firing a shot in anger - Australia (not the US) played a major contributing part but the UN made the elections possible - compare that to the 'success' and massive in anyones terms death toll in Iraq! geez....
Posted by BrainDrain, Friday, 10 November 2006 5:59:21 PM
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Easytimes writes "If disarming Saddam was such a success why was he trying so hard to keep the UN inspectors out?" (9 Nov 2006 6:08:07) as though this proves something other than Saddam was found to not hold nuclear, biological or chemical weapons, or programs to create them.

Easytimes is a person who accuses others of having their head in the sand, at the same time believing and stating that going into Iraq to rid Saddam of nuclear weapons actually avoided a "North Korea scenario." (8 Nov 2006 2:24:45 PM) and that invading Iraq avoided the "deaths of millions of our people." (8 Nov 2006 8:28:45 PM)

We continue to find people who continue to justify going to war and the resulting death of thousands upon thousands of people: soldiers, men, women and children, so to remove an imagined threat.

As the facts are recognised by every government, the only plausible objective of Easytime’s post is to continue the diversion of resourses and attention away from Osama Bin Laden and/or North Korea, the latter of which has been presented as a fait accompli.
Posted by David Latimer, Saturday, 11 November 2006 12:35:56 AM
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Comparing East Timor with Iraq…….. At least try and compare apples with apples Braindrain they are totally different. 99.9% of people in East Timor were begging for independence from Indonesia. Indonesia gave up East Timor freely. Also there is no parties trying to drive Australian and other peace keeping nations out. As for Iraq about 85% of them supported the toppling of Saddam. Iran Syria and other terrorist nations/organizations are pouring billions into trying to kill and destabilize Iraq. (Much to the pleasure of Braindrain and David Latimer)
So even for a nano brain like yourself Braindrain you can workout that comparing East Timor with Iraq is like comparing apples with oranges.

David Latimer please read my post again and you can then post an apology for miss quoting me again. I never said that invading Iraq saved millions of lives…….. put your glasses on!
Posted by EasyTimes, Saturday, 11 November 2006 12:09:16 PM
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Easytimes your argument and statements are an utter joke.

I don't criticise in here the obvious to Anyone evil of Syria and Iran interfering in another nations self destruction or millions (or merely thousands) of deaths they help cause.

Why not? because it is OBVIOUS - no need

I criticise the hypocraisy and not so obvious evil of America enlisting AUSSIES into an unjust war and creating the power vacuum that permitted all the current deaths in Iraq in the first place.

Why? BECAUSE IT IS NOT OBVIOUS TO ALL YET! And dorks and apologists like you only make it worse.

You will never find me justifyng war in Iraq from either supporters side and if your figure of 85% is accurate (like so much of what you say)- why did they not topple Saddam themselves in more than 25 years the way they are destabilising the occupied forces and 'government'?

Bush got it majorly wrong in Iraq and worse he dragged us and the coalition of the willing into it. The deaths since 2003 could have and should have been predicted. Bush is the cause. If he stays in Iraq as long as Saddam did the death toll will be higher under Bush than Saddam. He never belonged there in the first place.

I won't be holding my breath for your apologies to me for saying Iraq's disaster brings me any pleasure.
Posted by BrainDrain, Saturday, 11 November 2006 1:09:36 PM
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Response to Easytimes:

Yes, I'd like to correct my quote where I misread your statement about emerging nations, being proactive and the "deaths of millions of our people." (8 Nov 2006 8:28:45 PM) I mistook this statement as connected to the topic of Iraq and the rationale of disarming WMD's, however it is actually about past European death. As requested I retract and am sorry for writing you believe that Iraq saved millions of lives; clearly you do not believe that; and I quite freely admit that I cannot make any sense your statement whatsoever.

The total time between making this error and correcting it is 25 hours. The death toll remains at zero. I do not believe this retreat from my words has emboldened terrorism.

George Bush made a far more serious error over 32,000 hours ago, in commencing an invasion of Iraq and is yet to realise the enormity and tragedy of this mistake. As of yesterday, Bush continues to believe that "Iraq is the central front in this war on terror", and that front line troops are there to "win the war on terror." Rather than apologise, he says that "the world is more secure because of the leadership of Don Rumsfeld" (his sacked Defence Secretary.) http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2006/11/20061111.html
Posted by David Latimer, Sunday, 12 November 2006 1:34:54 AM
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David Latimer,

No, George Bush did not make a serious error in attacking Iraq, because:
(1) the turn of pre-war events (eg. Iraq disregarded UN resolutions) was such that a DECISION TO ACT has to be made some time. Going to war was the decision. The alternative is NOT TO ACT (and always do nothing).
(2) if Bush is successful in trainsforming Iraq, then today you would not say that was an error. (A hypocrisy on the part of most anti-Bush bashers).

Why is Bush not successful? Unlike post-war Japan and Gemany which prospered (under occupation), the most improtant factor is: ISLAM.

Secondly- you cannot win a war with one-hand tied, tied by stupid people who count death bodies.

The American body count matters a lot because every life is important in the US.

What about Iraqi body counts?? Well, go ask Muslim mothers who proclaim her wish to breed many sons so that they can give themselves to Allah (by turning suicide bombers). Also ask those Muslim leaders who accept such a martyrdom with glee.

In fact Bush has played a much more important role in history than many of his predecessors (eg. Clinton). Bush is the president who vocalised the danger coming from Islam, did something about it... and failed.

And his failure becomes a vital lesson to us:

(1) Islam rejects freedom and democracy. Therefore Iraq will never be democratic and free.

(2) We may never win the "War on Terrorism" because people like you tie the hands of those at war.

(3) If a secular military dictator rises up in our neighbour Indonesia, support him and take advantage of his secularism (at the expense of freedom and democracy, unfortunately)

(4) Our duty to ensure the Islam cancer does not spread further in Australia. The cancer is terminal and irreversible.
Posted by GZ Tan, Sunday, 12 November 2006 10:06:35 AM
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