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The Forum > Article Comments > The Bali two: deserving of a fair trial and punishment > Comments

The Bali two: deserving of a fair trial and punishment : Comments

By Mirko Bagaric, published 12/4/2006

It is a simplistic mindset that justifies the death sentence for Myuran Sukumaran and Andrew Chan.

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Still trotting out that line about 1000 heroin deaths a year Redneck, why don't you check your facts, as you know it is in fact about 400 - about 18,600 less a year than are killed by tobbaco. Do I have your support to head down the steet and execute the local corner store owner?

And as for all the money spent by junkies and the crimes committed to get it, what do you expect when you make sure that the only people selling drugs are the ones you would least trust to do it? What a joke. The main beneficiaries of the current system are drug dealers (because they get to sell a product at incredible mark-ups due to prohibition) and law enforcement employees (because they get a job). The ones who suffer are the people with drug problems (because they don't get the treatment that might help) and the rest of society (because we pay for it all). I do find it amusing though to think that the big-time drug dealers probably agree with the hang-em high sentiments expressed on here - after all, they never catch the bosses, and the risks keep the prices nice and high.

Anyway, back on topic, I don't think much of Mirko's writing, but I think even less of governments killing people, for any reason, ever. And as for the argument that they deserve it because they knew the penalty, that would apply equally well to the person threatened with execution in Afghanistan for becoming a christian? Do you all also think he should be killed?
Posted by hellothere, Wednesday, 12 April 2006 8:25:34 PM
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Hey bloggers, a raincheck, remember the AFP's (Australian Federal Police) role in all of this. Take an existential leap in this and reason what would have been Chan and Sukumarans' fate had they been picked up at the australian end. In all probability they would have been found to be middling players in this rotton conspiracy to import - no death penalty but a good wake up call as for all the rest of the nine. Don't consign them to the gallows because of misfortune, they deserve our ultimate compassion
Posted by jup, Wednesday, 12 April 2006 8:45:47 PM
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I don't support capital punishment and doubt that I ever will. But I respect the right of a country to make up its own mind about penalties. While in Australia drugs are seen to be a problem, Indonesians obviously see them as a HUGE problem. Apparently bigger than the problem of bombing popular tourist areas like Bali. I have no problem accepting that Indonesia has laws and will enforce them. I do, on the other hand, have a problem with people who know these laws, know the measures taken to enforce them and still choose to break them.
Posted by Otokonoko, Thursday, 13 April 2006 12:44:55 AM
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To Mr Hellothere.

Even if your spurious claim that heroin “only” caused “400” direct deaths in Australia was true, it still justifies the execution of serious drug traffickers.

Once again, you trot out the arguments of the neuronally challenged. All we have to do to prevent the bad side of drug abuse is to legalize the stuff. Oh yair. Tell me, does it bother you that there is not one single country on planet Earth that agrees with you? Even those that tried it have given up in despair.

Why don’t you just admit your own self interest here? You love taking illegal drugs and you feel sorry for your pushers when they get caught. You need to justify your own illegal and anti social behaviour, so you dream up a moronic philosophy which pretends to portray you and your druggie mates as rooly, rooly, intelligent, far seeing social progressives, while the responsible people who know better are all idiots.

I predict that your sad condition will persist up until the time when you have children yourself and begin to understand the vital importance of imparting pro social values into your kids. At least I hope that you grow up enough by then. I have often wondered if the reason why so many of our children are dying of drug abuse is because of “progressive” parents who think that they are cool if they encourage their kids own drug dependence.
Posted by redneck, Thursday, 13 April 2006 4:59:11 AM
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Absence from Australia might have deprived some people of the chance to witness the burlesque theatre known as the Australian legal system. We have had a high court judge who has been so honest that his file has been sealed for a number of years; we had a judge who patrolled the crappers at Wynyard station looking for young boys and was then driven home by the police special branch; a judge who should have been issued with a rubber car; and we currently have a high court judge who through his own admission broke the NSW Crimes Act for 13 continuous years. If the Indonesian legal system is tainted with corruption what the hell are we to make of our legal system?

Any arguments we might put up that less fortunate countries like Indonesia should aim to reach our lofty legal standards will be quickly elided by the facts.
Posted by Sage, Thursday, 13 April 2006 9:55:56 AM
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Marko wrote:

"As a society, we are committed to the principle that we are not required to wear the full cost of risks that we assume. We don’t refuse medical treatment to drunks who walk into the path of cars, obese people are not denied heart by-passes and ambulances don’t travel slower when calls for help are received by drug-users."

What concerns me is that a Professor of Law would consider posting this comment. There is a world of difference between what the Bali 2 were up to and the examples givgen.

In fact it worries me considerably that a Proffessor of Law, someong responsible for teaching law would put his name to such a nonsense article. It says a lot about the standard of teaching they would receive.

wd
Posted by wd, Thursday, 13 April 2006 12:07:24 PM
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