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The Forum > Article Comments > Lost between war and peace, the Leb wild Westies > Comments

Lost between war and peace, the Leb wild Westies : Comments

By Joseph Wakim, published 20/12/2005

Joseph Wakim argues the more Lebanese youths are demonised, the more they are driven to the margins of Australian society.

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Joseph tells us that Lebanese fled the horrors of war seeking peace and freedom in Australia. What is the very first thing that these eleutheromaniacs find so confronting? FREEDOM. The trauma suffered by Lebanese as they wrestled with freedom served as an augury of the inimicality of immigration from that area of the world. We are supposed to believe that a nation that ripped itself apart with a civil war is an ideal source of migrants.

How on earth can Joseph blame the head of a despised Western nation in John Howard and his dog-whistle politics for alienating Lebanese and at the same time tell us that Lebanese youth look to the USA, a more despised nation, for instructions on how to dress, act, and behave while wallowing in a dichotomous world of 'have and have not', lost opportunities and doors that are always closed to them. I have yet to run across any school that expels students because they are Lebanese. The rejection of education is the choice of the individual. The only difficulty this presents is to find someone or something to blame. Howard and Australians seem to be a convenient target for this.

Lebanese youths will be driven to the margins because of their diet of mindless rap music and worship of 'gangsta' figures coming from the USA. The absence of bruises on their bodies would indicate that no one is forcing them.
Posted by Sage, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 5:42:23 PM
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“There are a few basic principles which all Australians - old and new - must hold. These include loyalty to Australia and acceptance of the basic structures and principles of Australian society - the rule of law, tolerance, equality of opportunity, parliamentary democracy, freedom of speech and religion. English as the national language, and racial and sexual equality. It is illegal to discriminate on the basis of nationality, race, sex or religious belief.”

i think thats about it really. what else would you expect it to say? thou must drive either a holden or a ford? thou must bore me sh*tless with discussions of big brother or australian idol? thou must support a footy team? such 'cultural' descriptions are transient, they change and some kind of adherence to a sterotypical description of an 'aussie' is not a requirement for fulfilling the above statement. the reason statements like these and documents such as the constitution are usnspecific about behaviour or culture is because they are an attempt to state, in as few principals as possible, the basis of the society.

can anyone name any other basic principals of what it means to be australian? im willing to bet that any others raised are allready covered, probably a number of times in that statement.

just on that. by some of those standards and including a couple of arjay's points for a definition of 'ozzyness' from another thread (i dont agree with all, but the sense of humour and freedom from religion clauses i like), there are a few posters on this site who would not make the standard for an australian. ironicaly (as one must allways be when dealing with extremeism) such posters would probably classify themselves as the most patriotic.

but i guess we all must maintain the particular reality that agrees with us.
Posted by its not easy being, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 6:03:34 PM
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I agree. The statement, “There are a few basic principles which all Australians - old and new - must hold. These include loyalty to Australia and acceptance of the basic structures and principles of Australian society - the rule of law, tolerance, equality of opportunity, parliamentary democracy, freedom of speech and religion. English as the national language, and racial and sexual equality. It is illegal to discriminate on the basis of nationality, race, sex or religious belief.”, sounds pretty good to me. Both the far right Aryan gangs and the ethnic Lebanese gangs are not following these principles so they're both in the wrong and some education is clearly needed. Some education of our politicians wouldn’t go astray either. More education for everyone! Hang on, public schools aren’t properly funded and university degrees cost thousands of dollars…. Hmmm. I can see $55million that would have been better spent on some TV ads about the above definition of being Australian rather than WorkChoices....

Also since I’m an educated pedant (although one of the things about being an educated pedant is happiness in being corrected - but only if the corrector is correct will I be a willing corectee) and having paid my thousands for a law degree I could point out in respect of the above definition that:
1. The rule of law is a reasonably complex concept:
http://www.murdoch.edu.au/elaw/issues/v9n1/sykes91.html
2. Freedom of speech is not guaranteed under the Constitution:
http://www.aph.gov.au/library/pubs/rn/2001-02/02rn42.htm
3. Freedom of religion is not a complete guarantee under the Constitution:
http://www.hreoc.gov.au/speeches/human_rights/mission_australia.html
Posted by Pedant, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 7:03:49 PM
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I don't really care what their personal problems are , I just want the law to be applied in a manner appropriate to their crimes , preferably capital punishment and in public.
Posted by teamworktom, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 7:18:52 PM
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'The full force of law enforcement must be coupled with an understanding of the fears that underpin the anger that underpins the violence.'

Please explain what that means in practical terms. Explain how a policeman can use knowledge about the childhood influences of offenders to his advantage when he (or she) is confronted by an armed gang of 30 threating to kill him and/or rape his wife. It's good to understand the reasons behind the way people behave, it helps to make better decisions. But now we have a serious gang and organised crime problem on our hands in Sydney. That requires a policing strategy to protect everyone, of every racial background. The damaging of vehicles in Maroubra was wanton. Maroubra is a very 'mixed' suburb (I know, I was a postman there), and the people whose property was damaged would definitely have included a full range, not only the intended 'target' of 'Anglo's'. The businesses now suffering by the coast are of course owned or run by a wide range of different people. They are all being punished due to behaviour of gangs.

'Yet the more these youths are demonised, the more they are driven to the margins to find meaning and identification with gangs and a subculture of defiance.'

They are already behaving like demons, already at the margins, have already identified with gangs, and already have a fully developed subculture of defiance. The only reason it hasn't escalated to the US level yet is because of our stricter gun laws and our smaller population. The drug trafficking relies on international networks. We need to know where the drugs are coming from. We need to know where the guns are coming from.

I found the article too defensive. It's time to remove the big potato wedge off the shoulder and talk about realities on the ground. The most serious offenders act as role models for the younger and less experienced ones. That overrides the efforts of social workers. Counselling, etc. cannot work until a robust attempt to shut down the gangs occurs. Police intelligence and police action first.
Posted by Ev, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 8:35:32 PM
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Pedant

Correctee
Posted by keith, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 8:38:18 PM
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