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The Forum > Article Comments > Church welfare takes the well-paved road > Comments

Church welfare takes the well-paved road : Comments

By Peter Sellick, published 11/10/2005

Peter Sellick argues Church social welfare agencies have effectively become government agencies.

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Church agencies now get most of their funding from the government, and often find themselves doing its work at less cost than the government could do it itself. They have, effectively, become an arm of government.”
“Many mainline churches find their congregations are dwindling while their agencies expand with the help of government money.”

Do the religionists really do the job cheaper than could the government? Economists have suggested that, given the tax breaks (i.e. no tax paid) these charities enjoy, they are a huge burden on the taxpayer and the we would all be better off if the government removed the “throws” given to church-based charities and did the work itself. The recently revealed fact that many of them also operate businesses in direct competition with other businesses, but with the same charitable tax arrangements they have in their actual charity work, is cause for concern, too.

Given that the left-leaning Uniting and Anglican churches are great critics of the current government and meddlers-in-chief when it comes to government affairs such as IR legislation, security and anything else political that displeases their hierarchy, insult is certainly added to injury.
Posted by Leigh, Tuesday, 11 October 2005 11:08:45 AM
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"This is practical atheism. We do not, in the end, believe in the power of God to bring about the kingdom of justice and peace. We may say we work in His name, but I fear we march on without Him."

I say march on, march on, bring on the reality based world leave behind the faith based. It has served it's purpose we now have new corner stones.
Posted by Kenny, Tuesday, 11 October 2005 1:08:10 PM
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Thank you for this thoughtful and detailed analysis of the church's role. Much appreciated.
Posted by Sherrin Ward, Tuesday, 11 October 2005 4:31:09 PM
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Leigh.
I share your concern about tax free church based business competing with similar secular ones. This is especially the case for some Adventist agribusinesses that operate as normal business but without the tax burden. I am not sure of the case with church based hospital run by the Catholics and the Churches of Christ, do they also not pay tax? How about the Catholic universities? The church’s involvement in the caring services grew out of their traditional welfare role and I can see some point in this continuing in that while the bottom line needs to be watched, care is not distorted by the profit motive. I notice that the Salvation Army has sold a huge retirement village in our suburb. This appears to be a change in orientation on behalf of the Salvos that the other churches might follow.

Kenny.
What am I to do with you? My point would be that the faith based approach doe reveal the real world and that the world you live in is pure fantasy. Well, not perhaps pure, but at least largely misguided.
Posted by Sells, Tuesday, 11 October 2005 5:51:28 PM
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I think there is a lot more to Peter's argument that I can gleen from one or two readings. I remain unclear as to his point: Yes indeed Churches have become arms of Government - in the same way businesses small and large are tax collectors and in some cases law enforcers on the governments behalf; but a community that has lifted itself beyond the state of a few ram shackle huts behind a clay wall tends to be a complicated thing.

And yes we have moved away from the literalism of the new Testament waiting for the Kingdom of God to return- ( Where is Baoz David when you need him! ) if there is a date on that I must have missed the email. And yes our efforts are some what misguided at times. But sitting around having an inert faith in God and his workings would not seem to be a way to get much done.

Peter seems to imply we are trying to make a Kingdom of GOd on this planet in our time - cant say I see much to support that these days. He imples we are misguided and our altruism is false or misplaced. But what does he suggest we do instead - adorn our churches and pray more!.

Ive gotta read this one again.
Posted by sneekeepete, Wednesday, 12 October 2005 8:47:13 AM
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I appreciate sneekeepete’s confusion, this is are hard one to get across. I am not against activism. The Church must be engaged in the world and should speak about politics etc. My article is really about the basis on which it speaks and acts. It seems that much of what the church does can be described as a new kind of corporate Pelagianism. My remark about practical atheism goes to the centre of my concern. We may be active in the world only after God has been and is active in us. Otherwise we build the tower of Babel all over again, a new form of human triumphalism. Our theology tells us that God is among us in the form of the crucified and risen Christ. This is a real presence that is able to form human community into a community whose shape and action exists in the freedom of the Spirit. It is then able to act wisely in the world. O course we never know when this has happened to us; the life of faith involves trust. Neither do we go about simply believing, but with all our critical and rational talents intact.

I have been rereading Busch’s biography of Karl Barth and am amazed all over again how weak the church was in Germany when Hitler was coming to power. The Protestant church of the time, in all its forms was the liberal church writ large. It did not have the wit to see the danger that Hitler represented and many prominent church leaders went over to support the German Christians. The pastors that did oppose Hitler did so out of their faithfulness to God, seeing that Hitler was being deified by the German people. It was only faithfulness that could produce the courage of opposition.

Similarly, it is only faithfulness that will guide the Church of our day into right speech and action. No amount of sympathy for the poor or prattle about human rights will do the job.
Posted by Sells, Wednesday, 12 October 2005 10:42:08 AM
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I appreciate Sells response: I still struggle with the role the church has to play in our lives - as a returned catholic - now that will surpirse some of those familair with my scribblings - I have long struggled with the relevance that church actually has; as a kid I was mesmerised by the ceremony, the incense, the latin and the lyrical nature of much of the celebration - I was heavily involved as an Alter boy.

In retrospect I had no awareness of the meaning of the gospel even though I attended religious schools and indeed in my teens was a reader at mass. Even now I find it contradictory in so many ways. I was bombarded less with the message of Jesus and the good things than I was with how evil I was and essentially sinful.

So for me the pre occupation of the churches with "good works" albeit on the payroll of the government seems a more practical application of Christs message than focus on end time pronouncements and a pre occupation with witnessing for the lord; I thought that what the work actually was. In fact I think you can probably do both - in fact I think Sellick says as much towards the end of his article.

As I said I have more work to do here.
Posted by sneekeepete, Wednesday, 12 October 2005 12:00:18 PM
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There is much to be said about the meaning of the end time than I had room for. The end time is not a natural event, even thought apocalyptic language is used in the gospels and in Paul involve a convulsion in nature. Rather the writers of the NT used the language of apocalyptic to describe the discontinuity in history that was precipitated by the death and resurrection (not resuscitation) or Christ. The old world has to come to an end before the new can dawn. This process is not just a continuation of human progress but is truly the work of God in the world, the power of the proclamation of the gospel.

As is true in many such things end of the world language became the province of cranks and literalists who miss the point entirely. The kingdom of God is established in our time and place, it is not an escape from the world but a deeper involvement in it. This deeper involvement has its basis in the Word made flesh that reveals what we truly are and what the world truly is
Posted by Sells, Thursday, 13 October 2005 10:40:21 AM
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sneekeepete,
what are some of these contradictions you are encountering?
If you want, I would be delighted to discuss these with you by email.
joseph_howard@hotmail.com
Posted by Jose, Friday, 14 October 2005 7:42:57 AM
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Christian social action must never become mere unspiritual ideology. Christians mediate the gifts of "faith, hope, and love", which come down from the Divine. Their first commitment must be to build up the community of spiritual gift and prayfulness, which is the church. Therefore charitable works must be "inspirited" if they are to be dutiful: dead works do not build up.

The church is the first-light of that kingdom which will dawn everywhere, of course. The church approaches to it, especially in that perfect integration which the eucharist symbolises.

The author's theology is a very correct one. Welfare provision (and education and hospital services) is wrongly cut off from the church's spiritual life. I do not think we should scale back our good works, but realise their purpose as means of grace. We must use them to bring people into the worshipping community.

Of course, the banality and boredom of your average suburban church is a question for another day.
Posted by teatree, Sunday, 16 October 2005 12:15:22 AM
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