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The Forum > Article Comments > Australia has sound reasons to support the US against authoritarian China > Comments

Australia has sound reasons to support the US against authoritarian China : Comments

By Chris Lewis, published 12/7/2019

US grievances are justified given Chinas intellectual property theft, industrial subsidies, forced technology transfer and digital rules with regard to e-commerce.

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One sound reason is enough - self defence against an obvious aggressor. At the moment, China is the only threat to Australia. Without America we are toast. Someone needs to tell Morrison that.
Posted by ttbn, Friday, 12 July 2019 9:17:27 AM
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We should be concerned about China, its massive military build up, its clear and present expansionist ambitions and the theft of other nations and individual's intellectual property. Almost as if this nation was a highway robbing brigand and a law unto itself!?

For years voices in the wilderness have been warning our "leaders" that we were far too dependant on China and now nearly as dependent as a baby at the Mother's nipple!

And only because a few quislings in our parliaments, put their own narrow selfish self-serving interests ahead of all else. Thus we have allowed, price gouging, tax avoiding, profit repatriating foreign interests almost unfettered access to our mineral wealth, our massively overvalued real estate market and arable land!

Because conventional wisdom believed, if these foreign interests had a big enough stake, we would b safe? Almost if someone actually believed that any mad dictator could be swayed by rational argument rather than the usual (twitter bubble) whim and caprice!

Thus, we now have the world's most expensive energy and a manufacturing sector decimated by our own internal policies and total lack of real and now urgent Tax, energy and water reform.

Yes, by all means, back the US, but with a big stick in our back pocket not the wet tram ticket self-reliant, self-defence we would currently back it with. Plus our two-week reserve of oil!

All we have is the confident smiles of, I believe, clinically incompetent ministers to hold the line and protect our bought and paid for in blood, freedom and self-determination.

Thousands of Diggers and our forbears would to a generic man, be turning in their graves of the mess this nation has been allowed to descend to, from a position of the third wealthiest on the planet and a creditor one at that.

Bring on climate change and the drop-dead tipping point inside this decade. That's all you numbskulls have earned, with your selfish self -centred individualist Anti-Christian aspirations Yes, back the US, that's where they're currently heading
Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Friday, 12 July 2019 10:28:55 AM
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Haven't you heard Alan.

The climate scammers have dropped the whole tipping point narrative quietly in the bin, it was proving counter productive.

Every time they introduced some new imagined tipping point, to try to make up for the fact that CO2 in any scientific analysis just can't increase the temperature more than 1 degree, someone would prove their new tipping point was utter bulldust.

They became worried that with too much of their narrative proved to be utter bulldust, even the slowest & most committed useful idiots would finally wake up.
Posted by Hasbeen, Friday, 12 July 2019 12:15:37 PM
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Stop handing out "begger visas" which grant Chinese the rights to beg on our street corners..

Anything with China attached to it, comes with a high potential of criminal intent.

Dan
Posted by diver dan, Friday, 12 July 2019 12:18:47 PM
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The danger of China is real, but there is no need to join the USA in economic sanctions: just recognise Taiwan's independence, then the rest will fall into place automatically!
Posted by Yuyutsu, Friday, 12 July 2019 2:43:41 PM
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Australia has a Chinese future and everybody should start getting used to the fact. Just visit Sydney if you don't believe it! Everywhere one looks it's a sea of Chinese! When we show overseas visitors around Sydney they always ask the same question: 'What are all these Chinese doing here? Where are all the white people?'
Posted by Mr Opinion, Friday, 12 July 2019 7:19:20 PM
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Dear Mr. Opinion,

I see no problem with Chinese people, only with the Chinese communist regime.

I do understand that it can at times be difficult to distinguish between the Chinese-looking who support the communist regime and those who do not, including those who came to Australia for refuge from that terrible regime and will fight with us tooth-and-nail when China tries to invade Australia.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Saturday, 13 July 2019 8:10:32 PM
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Dear Yuyutsu,

When Japan bombed Pearl Harbor in 1941 there were 140,000 Japanese living Hawaii out of a total population of 420,000. That's one third of the population. The US government asked these Japanese to join the US armed services to fight against Japan. 2,000 of them volunteered to serve with the US and 20,000 of them went to Japan to fight against the US. The remainder were interned in the islands for the duration of the Pacific War.

If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck! The Chinese of the diaspora have a long and binding connection to their ancient roots and I doubt very much that they would be racing to enlist to fight against their ancestral homeland. You, along with most people in Australia, are just naive on this matter. The Chinese have come to Australia to take everything they can get their hands on and not to give!
Posted by Mr Opinion, Sunday, 14 July 2019 9:41:49 AM
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China, the Central Kingdom believes that only China is a sovereign country,
all other peripheral countries are vassal states.
These other states must pay tribute.
This principle is known as "tianxia".
President Xi recently made the point that the United States is NOT a
sovereign country.
They do not recognise the 1648 Westphalian Treaty which defined what
a sovereign country means, borders government etc.

This means that they can demand whatever rescorces they need.
Tianxia preceeds the Westphalian Treaty and China was not a party to
that treaty. You can see Tianxia in operation in the Sth China Sea
and in China's defiance of the International Court on that matter.
It explains how they can do things like shine lasers into they eyes
of US military aircraft pilots. They do not consider it to be a
criminal act. Likewise they can breach internation patents agreements
as they tianxia overrules such international agreements.

Quote President Xi to Australian PM;
"We will burn all our coal, then we will burn all yours".

That raises the question, what if we want to keep some for ourselves ?
Posted by Bazz, Sunday, 14 July 2019 12:28:14 PM
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Someone made a comment about Chinese looking people.
I watched a video item about the Chinese use of video cameras
everywhere and the monitoring of all Chinese citizens, and awarding
them points on their behavior such as walking against red lights,
throwing rubbish down, all sorts of anti civic behaviour.
If they have too many points against them they cannot buy a train
ticket to their home province, or travel internationally.
They are penalised in rental accommodation and all other sorts of privilege.

So they must have a significant advancement in facial recognition
software to tell them apart !
I have heard that they think we all look alike !
Posted by Bazz, Sunday, 14 July 2019 12:39:04 PM
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Dear Bazz,

Kudos! You are starting to think like a sociologist. Good work, keep it up.
Posted by Mr Opinion, Sunday, 14 July 2019 2:04:25 PM
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Mr O,

"When we show overseas visitors around Sydney they always ask the same question: 'What are all these Chinese doing here? Where are all the white people?'"

Given that only 5% of Sydney's population is Chinese born ( a further 5% has at least one Chinese born parent), then its a little hard to understand why your guests only see Chinese people. Perhaps you need to get them to remove the yellow tinted glasses.

" 2,000 of them volunteered to serve with the US and 20,000 of them went to Japan to fight against the US. The remainder were interned in the islands for the duration of the Pacific War."

That's just rubbish. Almost none of the Japanese on Hawaii were interned. None returned to Japan - how would they even do that after war was declared? More than 2000 Japanese who'd already volunteered before 7/12/41 were used to man Hawaii's defences in the event of a Japanese landing although they were later moved to the mainland.

Do you just make this stuff up?
Posted by mhaze, Sunday, 14 July 2019 2:50:40 PM
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Dear mhaze,

From your comment it is obvious that you do not live in Sydney. Come to Sydney and have a look for yourself if you don't believe me. You'll walk away saying exactly what I am saying.

You have made a personal attack on my integrity so I will return it. Going on what I've seen of other things you write I do not think you are in a position to assess if what I am saying is correct or incorrect. You do not come across to me as an educated and knowledgable person.
Posted by Mr Opinion, Sunday, 14 July 2019 5:38:50 PM
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Mr O,

We've been down this road before. My figures on Chinese in Sydney is based on Australian Bureau of Statistics data.Its utterly irrelevant whether I live in Sydney or not.

As to the Japanese in Hawaii post-7/12/41, again my comment was based on facts from the period. Your's was based on - well I'm not sure what it was based on, but it wasn't anything that actually happened. Just for fun, explain to us how 20000 Japanese civilians got from Hawaii to Japan in the midst of a war? This oughta be good.
Posted by mhaze, Sunday, 14 July 2019 5:52:58 PM
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mhaze,

I don't think you have ever been to Sydney. Instead of relying on second hand information I suggest you come here and have a look around and make your own assessment from your own experience.

They swam of course!
Posted by Mr Opinion, Sunday, 14 July 2019 6:16:11 PM
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Dear Mr. Opinion

I would also be interested in any references you may be able to present regarding these 20,000 Japanese in Hawaii.

Is it possible that the sole reason they left Hawaii was to avoid detention? Then have they voluntarily enlisted in the Japanese army or were they conscripted? And were they of all age groups - obviously those too young or old, women too at the time, could not be asked to serve in either army?

Also, could the fact that the Americans in Hawaii forced the exclusive use of the English language be a factor? They did so to quash the local Hawaiian culture and it was terrible for the native Hawaiians, but the Japanese migrants could potentially also been affected.

In any case, it is difficult to compare the Japanese in Hawaii with the Chinese in Australia because the former were not oppressed in their home country (but were likely economical migrants) whereas the latter are victims of a cruel communist regime: surely we don't want to return victims into the jaws of their tormentors!

The challenge ahead is to develop better sophisticated methods to separate the sheep from the goats.

BTW, when you mention "Sydney", do you mean the greater metropolitan area or just the inner city of Sydney? This is because Chinese people seem (for reasons beyond my understanding) to like congregating in inner big cities. I personally avoid inner cities like the plague if I can.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Sunday, 14 July 2019 10:39:19 PM
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Oh dear...ABS data, according to Mr O is " second hand information". I have no words to describe how utterly bonkers that is.

"They swam of course!"

Translation...he totally made up the story of the 20,000 Japanese return from Hawaii to fight for Japan. Totally made it up...act accordingly.
Posted by mhaze, Monday, 15 July 2019 8:54:09 AM
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Dear Yuyutsu,

I recall reading those figures somewhere. The author also stated that by the end of the Pacific War there were only 60,000 left out of the 120,000 interned on the islands. I have also read another author who says there was no internment in Hawaii because business bosses needed the Japanese as labourers in the cane industry; he says that about 1,500 were sent to the mainland interment camps. The former account makes more sense to me because I find it hard to believe that Americans would have liked the idea of tens of thousands of Japanese walking around freely in Hawaii just it had beed attacked.

mhaze is arguing that none of the Japanese in Hawaii would have returned to Japan to fight for their homeland. I suppose he believes in general that when a war breaks out no one ever returns to their country to fight in a war. I don't believe that because the history books are full of stories about people making their way back home to fight for their country.

Come to Sydney and have a look around and make up your own mind on whether or not Sydney has an inordinately huge Chinese population. I would like people from across Australia to come and see how Sydney is now a predominantly Chinese populated city. There are less Chinese around the perimeter like Blue Mtns, Northern Beaches, Sutherland Shire, etc., but they are gradually making inroads into these areas. So come and have a look.
Posted by Mr Opinion, Monday, 15 July 2019 10:35:52 AM
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"mhaze is arguing that none of the Japanese in Hawaii would have returned to Japan"

I didn't say none. I said your claim (which we now know was completely fabricated) that 20000 went back was utter rubbish. Yes, in other wars, some nationals returned home eg between Germany and France. But they were adjoining and people could walk etc. Did the 20000 Japanese walk home? What a dill.

" I would like people from across Australia to come and see how Sydney is now a predominantly Chinese populated city."

Or just access the ABS data to see that this claim utter racist pap.
Posted by mhaze, Tuesday, 16 July 2019 11:15:41 AM
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An Australian puts up a 'for sale' sign in front of his home....
someone offers a fist full of dollars...
Is he looking at the buyers face or the money in his hand?
The only people bitching here are those that don't have a place to sell... Do Australians really think that Australia is going to remain as it was?...as it is?....
now who is the delusional amongst us?
Posted by Special Delivery, Tuesday, 16 July 2019 8:44:03 PM
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Dear mhaze,

My statements are based on what I see when I walk around the streets, catch public transport, or go shopping. ABS tells us 1 in 30 is Chinese in Sydney but when you look around and do a head count it is more like 1 in 2. So why is there such a big discrepancy between what the ABS is saying and what one actually sees in reality? Just come to Sydney and have a look for yourself and you can put the ABS figures to the test for yourself.
Posted by Mr Opinion, Wednesday, 17 July 2019 6:50:45 AM
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