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The Forum > Article Comments > An end to unspeakable acts of violence > Comments

An end to unspeakable acts of violence : Comments

By Chris Fotinopoulos, published 27/10/2017

Are we happy for the elderly to sleep with a loaded firearm beneath their pillow?

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Risible rubbish!

Nobody is forced to accept unwanted palliative care, which can and does snuff out the life force almost daily in almost any large city hospital.

This is a witless bystander witness approach? And not something from the pen of a stroke victim or the terminally ill?

Simply put, we're able to withhold, miracle cure nuclear medicine, to treat countless, death sentence inoperable cancers!

But don't have too much of a problem allowing access to a life terminating poison!

Just what does that say about us and our alleged priorities!?

As someone with an apparently inoperable brain tumour and recovering from a stroke, which hasn't helped a serious lower back injury (five spinal fractures) that forced an early retirement!

WTFH would you know sonny?

And just who gave you the right to decide on what is quality of life!?

As for a loaded firearm beneath a pillow?

If I had the choice sonny, I'd have one!

Not to top myself but gut shoot the intending armed intruder, in the liver! [That's your warning shot punk!]:-)

These days, not even safe to set foot outside the house, to check the fuse box! Nor it would seem, in the stroke ward (target for tonight) of a large regional hospital? As for me? I'll live till I die and on my feet fighting, not on my knees begging for relief!

And if I want to end it? Why wouldn't a 9 mm round very rapidly injected into the brain pan, be more painful or slower than Nembutal?

I could do it in the shower, with the water running if you're bothered by unseemly blood sonny?

Or you can do what any fair minded person would and start badgering gormless pollies to allow peaceful purpose only, nuclear energy!

Which might allow me and countless others to go to our maker at the predetermined/appointed time, by the method already chosen! The day we came into this world!

Not a minute more nor a minute less!
Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Friday, 27 October 2017 9:39:43 AM
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We are taught from childhood, to take control of our own destiny. Throughout life we chart our own destinies. So at the end of life, why should the moral question take us further away from the final act of suicide?
Suicide becomes a philosophical question in the end: However, there are clauses.

One is, if suicide is chosen as a selfish means of avoiding consequences of errant behaviour, such as, for example, bankruptcy or failed relationship or an act of evil, the guilt of which is intolerable, I believe that to be an act of cowardice.
If suicide is a decision to be made to end physical suffering, the like of which is untreatable and insufferable, suicide is justified.

But then, way down at the bottom of the list of grubby acts, is a suicide bomber, the most detestable and inexcusable acts of suicide
Posted by diver dan, Friday, 27 October 2017 12:16:30 PM
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Could someone please first enlighten us regarding the facts?

Is any institution currently legally allowed to grab us away from our homes and imprison us in an aged-"care" facility?

The most dignified and sinless way to die when our time comes, is to just stop eating, allowing our body to waste away and return to the elements.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Friday, 27 October 2017 12:38:48 PM
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They would struggle to get a permit for a firearm small enough to fit under a pillow. Buy Nembutal (overseas, as they would have to) and they would more than likely be visited by the AFP and charged with importing a prohibited drug. They might get a warning if, when the liquid was tested, it was found to be tap water (which often happens).

Just quietly, I don't think the author's grand daddy was serious about shooting himself, performing ostentatious displays of checking a weapon in front of his grandson, then complaining, when he was close to death, that he couldn't assemble the gun.

And, if two octogenarians per week are killing themselves, that is there business and nothing to do with the rest of us.

This is just another appeal to the nanny state to interfere not just in our lives, but also in our deaths. All people have the right to kill themselves – not much can be done to you afterwards. But, don't ask society to take the responsibility.

People living into the 80s and 90s are usually kept alive by expensive drugs (a paradox, given the constant whingeing about 'ageing populations' and how much they cost). So, stop taking the drugs; reject all treatment; stop being tortured by rent-seeking medical researchers, and have palliative care. You cannot be made to eat, take life-extending medication or payroll greedy doctors.
Posted by ttbn, Friday, 27 October 2017 12:58:01 PM
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Many years ago I had a dog I which I loved more than I care for most people.
He was diagnosed with multiple myeloma - a form of lieukemia with a 100% mortality rate.
I watched my best mate slowly go downhill.
I had him in the vet for a week or so, visiting every day and it cost me a bit in tests and care trying to save him; but nothing would help so I brought him home for his last days.

I took him to the beach and his favourite places.

He tried chew at his front forearm where the marrow was hurting him.
He'd lost weight and started to go lame.
His eyes glazed over and he went blind.
He bled from his nose, and maybe a little from his bum and crotch towards the end in his final days as well.

In his better days he loved playing fetch the ball.
He lived for it, it was his favorite thing.
Even when he was more or less completely blind he still loved his ball and wanted to play.

But finally the day came when he didn't want to play any more.
And I knew that that the time had come.

He walked into the vet on his own four legs the following day.
It cost just $15 for the shot would soon kill him.
His eyes went open wide as he received that dose of green liquid, and he drifted off to another place, died in my arms, and I closed his eyes...

I loved my dog 'Buddy' - R.I.P mate.
Killing him was the final act of kindness I could offer him.
Posted by Armchair Critic, Friday, 27 October 2017 8:56:27 PM
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Consensual homocide. That's what this "ethicist" is arguing for. In fact that's exactly what "assisted suicide" or "voluntary euthanasia" is. Knowingly causing the death of another is Homocide.

And well said Alan. Agree if it's a personal choice carried out by the self by own chosen means how dare anyone deny that ultimate liberty. Agree also on your right to keep that 9mm. Should be everyones. Rather orwellian that the control freaks who'd deny you the means to end your life also deny you the means to defend it.
Have lost relatives and aquaintances to suicide. Mourned the loss and lamented the circumstances that led to their sense of hopelessness but never disrespected them for their fateful choice.
Posted by jamo, Saturday, 28 October 2017 12:31:33 AM
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"right to keep that 9mm"? We are talking about the right to do away with yourself here, not the right 'to bear arms'. You don't have the right to keep Nembutal in the house, so applying for a permit with the reason for doing so 'to top myself when I feel like it' is never going to happen. I repeat: do what you like to yourself, but do not expect the rest of society to help you out or take responsiblity for your decision.
Posted by ttbn, Saturday, 28 October 2017 8:12:23 AM
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Armchair Critic:

Been there and done that! Nell was my loyal companion and best mate for around nine years.

She had all her shots and the very best care I could afford!

Everywhere I went she wanted to go. We used to pass a replica horse on an occasional shopping trip. I'd say look, she'd bark and growl, then wag her stumpy tail as the horse disappeared from sight, in the rear view.

As always, she'd fearlessly place herself between me and anything that might possibly harm me? Regardless!

As for Buddy, Bismuth 213 would have resulted, I believe, in remission!

And if made plentiful! Also affordable!

For mine, many of our animal friends are better and worth more than many humans! And deserve a chance as opposed to having a valuable life truncated!

Simply because some politicians are stuck in their own fear filled fact free vacuum, somewhere south of the eighteenth century?

And when it comes to nuclear energy and desirable offshoot consequences, like alpha particle isotope, miracle cure, Bismuth 213. That quite literally can mean life or death for us and or our loved ones!

Be they two legged or four?

Perpetually prevaricating pollies can't get past, wind, solar, hydro power and olden coal. Wind, solar, hydro power and olden coal. Wind solar, hydro power and olden coal.

So, R.I.P Buddy, Nell and some of our comrades, trying to hang on for family and friends for as long as they're able! While a gormless few, watch and feel so personally uncomfortable, they think that your life is less worthless than a dog!?

And in innumerable cases, would simply stuff it out? Then hand the death certificate to a Doctor, that may have never ever seen the patient, [for a natural causes,] validating signature?

Wind solar hydro power and olden coal. And repeat seven thousand times!

Bismuth 213 advocates will eventually get the message! Even as the tears stream down cheeks as they shovel sod!
Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Saturday, 28 October 2017 9:13:41 AM
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Hey Alan B,
Good to hear about your times with Nell.
You can't replace them can you...
And some people just don't get it.

I've never heard of 'Bismuth 213' before, but I'm going to look it up.
I was offered the option of allowing him to be taken to a university vet where they may have tried different treatments on him; they may very well have tried that drug, I'm not sure, but I just couldn't stand the idea of him being on his last legs poked and prodded until death with me not there.
I'd lost my license at the time and I didn't really have the insight or means to investigate the University Vet option or potential treatments.
He was an awesome dog, really smart, good with kids, could take him anywhere I went, and could leave him out the front of stores I went into without being tied up and he'd stay right there.
Poor little mate, died before his time.

I was actually thinking about it last night - that he was gnawing at his front forearm and thought to myself, why didn't I remove the forearm?
I probably did question the vet at the time, even though it was an ugly option, but being blood disorder - don't know if it would've made any difference.
It's a shame I didn't know about 'Bismuth 213' at the time.
Damn, it sucks when you feel like you let them down.

"So, R.I.P Buddy, Nell and some of our comrades, trying to hang on for family and friends for as long as they're able!"
- Thanks for saying that.

Anyway, I commend your efforts always pushing the Thorium agenda, though I don't totally understand it all.
You probably get tired constantly reminding everyone of it, but you're doing a good thing.
Has the pilot plant / feasability now been shown to be good / viable / cost effective with this technology now?
Posted by Armchair Critic, Saturday, 28 October 2017 10:15:25 AM
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"Are we happy for the elderly to sleep with a loaded firearm beneath their pillow?"

Where an author's facts and argument have merit, there is never a need to 'sex up' the headline or opening to get interested readers. It was a very silly, ill-conceived and inappropriate for all sorts of reasons. The public is aware of the negative stereotyping of Australian legally licensed firearms owners. In view of the recency of the LA tragedy, which was in a separate sovereign nation half a world away and with social and other problems entirely different to Australia's, it might be construed as opportunist ambulance-chasing. The tabloid media and opportunist politicians have worked that to disgusting levels and earned their public revulsion.
Posted by leoj, Saturday, 28 October 2017 12:22:09 PM
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So it's Consensual Homocide Ok and Personal Suicide Bad. What a universe of contradictions we find ourselves in when the socialist champions of compassion start bumping into their own shadows.
The arguement here is saying ones own choice by available means is unspeakably bad but if presumably ones own choice is agreed to by another then it's pure and compassionate that the choice is physically carried through by another on the one. (He begged me to do it your honour, honest..).
At the very least it's an example of the busybody socialist control freaks determination to never allow a personal decision be made without their involvement.

As for comparisons with euthanasia of animals. Have livestock so have to do that myself from time to time. It's always an act of compassion but it's never their choice. With humans it'd be straight up homocide.

This topic is about legalising Homocide. Period.
Which brings me to a question for the ethicists. In a free marketplace should the compassionate helper negotiate a required fee and take payment before agreeing to administer compassion? Or Perform compassion and bill the estate or remaining family members later? Or maybe if the helper's so compassionate about carrying out compassion do it for free or for just the contents of the compassion seekers wallet at the time instead of billing the relatives?
Posted by jamo, Saturday, 28 October 2017 4:15:07 PM
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Armchair, a comprehensive trial was conducted in the sixties/seventies by Alvin Weinberg, the inventor/patent holder of the first working nuclear reactor.

Understood as nobody else could, that design flaws and a solid fuel system that relied on around 300 atmospheres; plus problematic solid fuel that expanded inside a fixed space! Would eventually encounter problems. As borne out in Three Mile Island, Chernobyl And Fukushima.

All relying on engineered safety in triplicate and constant human vigilance. Moreover, in solid fuel the Bismuth 213 is locked inside the spent solid fuel rods and notoriously difficult to recover?

However, virtual child's play to recover from an operational molten salt reactor from the plumbing, given the thing is not pressurised, nor does it need to be!

Because the boiling point of molten fluoride is around 1400 C and all the sweet spot operating temperatures varying between 400-700 C! Able to rely exclusively, on built in, walk away safe, passive safety!

Take a U tube butchers at the case for thorium, where you could read me? Or better yet, Kirk Sorensen or Professor Hargreaves. The latter the Author of, Thorium, cheaper than coal.

Professor Hargreaves, the source of a 1,98 cents P.K.H. as the median, for a thorium powered molten salt reactor.

Which as a comparative 350 M.W reactor, the FUJI molten salt reactor the Brazilians are planning for, would burn just one ton of thorium fuel during its entire useful operating life!

With any remnant waste, stable in around a decade.

Contrast that with a traditional light water reactor and total 2251 tons of highly enriched fuel. Almost as expensive and rare as platinum, creating almost as much waste, with a half life of thousands of years!

And preferred by that clever Taswegian, cause he knows, it'll never fly here!

By all means check all the validated, peer reviewed facts and then get in the queue demanding the pollies do something that follows logic's rites, with regard to our energy policy and price structure!

If only to ensure there are far fewer Buddy and Nell tragedies, in the future!
Cheers, Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Saturday, 28 October 2017 5:32:05 PM
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Addendum.
Given a molten salt thorium reactor is the best possible, easiest obtained source of bismuth 213!

I thought you may like the following fact? Thorium contains 200 times the energy of uranium and 2,000 times less waste! And arguably our very best, carbon free chance, for not only reversing climate change?

But giving sick pets and people by the thousand, a chance at an extended pain free life or even complete remission!

Even as eternally vacillating/prevaricating politicians, worry how they can fund their next election, without overt or covert, fossil fuel funding? All that currently prevents it?

If, but only if, you are genuinely concerned about the well being and welfare of the terminally ill? GENUINELY!

Then do something more than merely make it easier for the sick/emotionally disturbed to get assistance to end their worthless lives!

We have absolutely everything to gain from thorium and a de-privatised energy sector and absolutely nothing of any true value or worth to keep or save, by the adoption of peaceful purpose only, nuclear energy!

Lets give the terminally ill something besides a chance to terminate their pain-racked narcotic addicted lives!

Lets give them hope, comfort and a pain free existence, for the term of their natural lives!Via bismuth 213?

Be they two legged or four legged friends or family!

Just being able to hold your water would be a useful start! Or am I asking for too much?
Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Saturday, 28 October 2017 10:44:28 PM
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Hey Alan
"If, but only if, you are genuinely concerned about the well being and welfare of the terminally ill? GENUINELY!"

Well, I might talk a lot of crap at times, but in all seriousness what I saw my little mate go through at the end I'm not sure I could wish on my worst enemy. It's just to cruel that kind of suffering, and he took it with his chin up too, tough little bloke he was.
He was a brindle staffy cross kelpie.

R.I.P Buddy and Nell.
Lets hope the pair of them are upstairs in a better place having a right old time waiting for us!

Regards the MSR, you did take the time to give me some info on a previous occasion.
This time, I've copied your message down so I can look right into it.
Started watching a video this afternoon:
MSRE: Alvin Weinberg's Molten Salt Reactor Experiment - "Th" Thorium Documentary
http://youtu.be/knofNX7HCbg

And to everyone here in regards 'Consensual homocide'
Call it whatever you want.
I loved that dog more than I did most people and I'd do it again a 1000 times to end his suffering if I had to, but I'd never willingly want to.

There's got to be a humane answer for this issue.
To think the elderly just wait around to die, with no visitors and suffering horribly doesn't seem to have much dignity in mind, and without disrespect, it sounds more like a grab for cash to take every last bit they've got.
In some ways it's disgraceful, when you think about it.
Posted by Armchair Critic, Sunday, 29 October 2017 6:39:38 PM
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