The National Forum   Donate   Your Account   On Line Opinion   Forum   Blogs   Polling   About   
The Forum - On Line Opinion's article discussion area



Syndicate
RSS/XML


RSS 2.0

Main Articles General

Sign In      Register

The Forum > Article Comments > The fallacy of the phonics screening check for Australia > Comments

The fallacy of the phonics screening check for Australia : Comments

By Paul Gardner, published 23/8/2017

The ability to decode individual words, using synthetic phonics is not synonymous with reading, and the claim for a causal relationship between improved decoding and raised standards of reading is not born out by the evidence.

  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. All
Indifferent.
In - diff - er - ent.
Stop being bloody difficult, and start teaching the kids to read again.
It's quite simply pathetic that Grade 6 kids cant read.

If you can't do it someone will create a free ipad app that can, and it will be of more benefit to the kids than your whining.
Posted by Armchair Critic, Wednesday, 23 August 2017 8:19:03 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
I want to add further to my previous comment by sharing a story I heard last week from an Aussie truck driver last week who'd been having some drama's with the local primary school and he's son.

They called him into school to talk about his boy.
They said he'd been falling behind in English, and that he needed extra help or else he might fall further behind and have to repeat.
Alan (truck driver) says "Well what other subjects is he doing?" and they must've told him he was also doing German as a subject.
So Alan says "Well why don't you cut back on the lessons in German, and focus more on his English?"
"No sir, we can't do that, it's not part of the curriculum"
Alan "What point is there in him learning bloody German if he's not even learning English?"

I agree with Alan, you people are idiots.
Posted by Armchair Critic, Wednesday, 23 August 2017 8:34:17 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Absolutely agree with Armchair!

Moreover, your opinion remains just that Paul! And even before uttering, has clearly foundered on irrefutable facts and the sheer numbers of kids now leaving school as virtually unemployable illiterates, who all too often go on to become part of the rising divorce rate or prison population statistics.

All we seen from folk with your iron willed obsession is opinion and assumption completely divorced from literal reality!

There's nothing wrong with dream castles in the clouds, except when you move in as permanent residents?

You must be able to take considerable comfort, in the fact you are never ever wrong!
Alan B.
Posted by Alan B., Wednesday, 23 August 2017 11:34:16 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
This endless false dilemma: OF COURSE kids should read for meaning, for fun, for exploring. But first they have to know how to read.

My late wife ran a small Indigenous pre-school, where she strove to ensure that the kids LIKED books, she read then their favourite stories, let them browse through any books available, gave them their 'favourite word', Sylvia-Ashton-Warner-style, meaningful words, and let them choose their favourite book for her to read to them. Also a period of 'silent reading', i.e. looking at the pictures of their favourite books - i.e. learning to LOVE reading, to understand that they could get pleasure out of it. Also pre-reading games, singing the alphabet, etc. etc., so even before they went on to school, they had some basic phonics and more importantly, an interest in reading.

OF COURSE, once kids have mastered the basics, they can, at their own pace, move onto reading material etc. that interests them. But why does anybody think that the two processes can't be done alternately, simultaneously, whatever ?

This is a phony argument to absolve lazy and ignorant teachers from what THEY see as boring, i.e. reading the same stories over and over just because the kids like them, going over the same rules - and their exceptions - until the kids are comfortable with them. Boring - so much easier to focus on the really 'bright' kids who get help from ambitious parents at home.

Joe
Posted by Loudmouth, Wednesday, 23 August 2017 6:09:18 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
I cannot understand why they would teach them to read nonsense words.

That defeats and confuses the whole process of learning phonetics to recognise a word by sounding out the letters.

It's simple, there are 26 words in the alphabet and they all have a sound.
Learn the sounds then sound out the letters to recognise words.
Most words in English can be recognised this way.
Words like laugh and a few strangely spelt words are an exception, but about 96%
of words can be sounded out and recognised.

It should start out with very Simple word stories accompanied by pictures.
With words like cat, mat, etc.
There should be nothing hard about it if it is done correctly.
Learning nonsense words is ridiculous. What academic dill thought that one up.
Posted by CHERFUL, Thursday, 24 August 2017 10:48:15 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
sorry, that should have said. " 26 letters" in the alphabet."
Posted by CHERFUL, Saturday, 26 August 2017 10:17:34 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Hi Cherful,

OR: don't worry about the pissy words, cat, hat, run, etc., but as Sylvia Ashton-Warner advocated, let kids pick their own words: she worked with Maori kids up go the seventies and let them choose words from their own lives, pretty active, hectic, often violent words like kiss, murder, gun, rifle, punch, beer, drown. My wife let her pre-schoolers pick words and they even chose words like helicopter, crocodile, laugh, fight, arse, chops, tractor. THEIR words, words that interested them.

Once kids are turned onto reading by making words meaningful, and maybe stringing them together into a story, then we can get them studying Shakespeare and Proust and Derrida and Chomsky. But let them enjoy it first before they trek off into those limitless deserts.

Joe
Posted by Loudmouth, Monday, 28 August 2017 10:44:20 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Thank you David for a clear and logical argument. Phonics is an important skill. However, do we need to test out Yr 1s? No. Why do we need to waste money on another highstakes test that is not for making things better for kids but to add even more accountability measures on schools? Especially when Australia does better than the UK in international tests on reading.The CIS are getting too much traction, we need to offer other opinion and facts to the Minister.
Posted by saynotophonicstest, Tuesday, 29 August 2017 1:02:04 PM
Find out more about this user Visit this user's webpage Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
My apologies - my reply was meant for PAUL!
Posted by saynotophonicstest, Tuesday, 29 August 2017 1:03:35 PM
Find out more about this user Visit this user's webpage Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Hi Say NoToCommonSense,

We shouldn't test Year 1s ?! Of course, we should, tactfully of course, but surely any Year 1 teacher would be constantly aware of which kids are having trouble, and which kids are already flying. And of course you focus on the kids who are having trouble, interesting them in story books, even in just the pictures at first, connecting things in the pictures to the words for those things, dragon, horse, flying, danger, etc. Meaningful words that relate to the story.

Surely any capable Year 1 teacher would be aware of who to concentrate on by the end of the second week, and precisely what stage in the learning process they were at ? With so few kids in the average class these days, it should be a doddle.

Joe
Posted by Loudmouth, Tuesday, 29 August 2017 1:16:03 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. All

About Us :: Search :: Discuss :: Feedback :: Legals :: Privacy