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The Forum > Article Comments > Australian-Indonesian relations threatened by executions > Comments

Australian-Indonesian relations threatened by executions : Comments

By Duncan Graham, published 22/12/2014

The first batch is reportedly all Indonesians, but the next group could include Australians Andrew Chan, 30, and Myuran Sukumaran, 33. The two men, members of the Bali Nine drug syndicate caught in 2005 and sentenced in 2006, have exhausted all appeals.

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Everybody with half a brain knows what the penalties are if they get caught trafficking drugs in many of the Asian countries!
Yet they continue to run this particular gauntlet!

I mean, everyone who has volunteered for front line duty, knows that his or her life could be forfeit in a heartbeat!
And would therefore not volunteer, unless the risk and reward were both acceptable! Ditto civilian emergency response forces!

Yes it's always sad when any young life is snuffed out performing a duty, or trying to save or rescue someone else!

Drug traffickers on the other hand have no noble motives whatsoever, and may even contribute to the death of an innocent or hardened addicts; made so by just these activities.

So, if the risks aren't acceptable when measured against the reward, well just don't bother.

If you chose to undertake such risky business, it's your lookout if you come to grief!

And make sure you don't leave home with a suitcase or travel-bag unlocked; least you be used as Shapelle Corby was alleged to have; and by thoroughly tainted evidence that would've been accepted in few other places!

However, if you knowingly transport drugs through foreign jurisdictions, even highly suspect or patently corrupt or inherently evil ones?

Just cop it sweet, ditto if caught poaching illegally!

Do the crime do the time; or where it's still the law, worse!

Personally, I'd bring back capital punishment for some crimes!
There are worse things than murder, and some will offend again and again at the first opportunity.

In conclusion let me say, if you don't want to face the firing squad in Bali, don't get caught trafficking drugs in Bali or other equally dangerous places, including Saudi Arabia!
Posted by Rhrosty, Monday, 22 December 2014 8:50:32 AM
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Indonesians doing the dirty in Australia should be subject to Australian law. Australians doing the dirty in Indonesia should be subject to Indonesian law. It's that simple.
Posted by david f, Monday, 22 December 2014 9:20:08 AM
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Sorry Duncan, time to grow up little man. As Rhrosty says, if you do the crime, you accept you do the time, if you get caught. We don't need bleeding hearts sobbing all over these criminals, who don't give a damn about anyone else..

I do like your emotive garbage about "shredding torsos". It is just that, cheap garbage.

It is about time we sent a few of our senior politicians up there to learn how to dispense justice, & how to run a prison, rather than a holiday camp for thugs.

When we see these drug profiteers worrying about the harm caused to the people who's lives the drugs destroy, it might be time to feel some sympathy for them, meanwhile let the shredding commence.
Posted by Hasbeen, Monday, 22 December 2014 9:22:47 AM
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There are several solutions in this case.

They could be let off with a suspended sentence. (That is to say, suspended from a large oaken beam by a strong hempen rope.)

On the other hand, their case could be processed, as Breaker Morant would have advocated, under rule 303.

I find it difficult to argue with opponents of the death penalty as their arguments seem to be completely emotional.

The only comforting thing about the several recent encounters with islamic terrorists in Australia is that in each case there was an immediate administration of the death penalty. Considering that the death of a person facing life imprisonment in NSW saves the government over a million dollars in prison costs, the question is, in the case of the recent siege in Martin Place, who fired the million dollar shot?
Posted by plerdsus, Monday, 22 December 2014 6:41:26 PM
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There should be a fund opened to recompense the Indonesian Government for the ammo expended.
Posted by Is Mise, Monday, 22 December 2014 6:47:32 PM
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I'm with the others on this one, we enter their country and in doing so accept their laws. If we don't like it, don't go there. Its just a pity we don't make certain groups respect our laws.

The bit that puzzles me is why these guys are getting the chop, yet Chapel gets off. A woman thing perhaps!
Posted by rehctub, Tuesday, 23 December 2014 6:14:14 AM
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Maybe the policy of that Socialist Nirvana of the Middle Kingdom, bill the family for the lead injection?
Posted by McCackie, Tuesday, 23 December 2014 8:34:13 AM
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We are the ones who put our own citizens in danger of being shot by firing squad. The AFP acted on information and made the astonishing decision to assist the Indonesians to arrest these drug smugglers in Indonesia. If the AFP had waited and arrested them on Australian soil the Bali 9 would not be in this position. This matter would have been handled by the Australian justice system and none of them would have faced the death penalty.
Posted by BJelly, Tuesday, 23 December 2014 8:46:17 AM
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Well B Jelly, all I can say is brovo to the AFP because have saved the tax payer millions. Scum are scum regardless of where they get caught.
Posted by rehctub, Tuesday, 23 December 2014 12:42:17 PM
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"The bit that puzzles me is why these guys are getting the chop, yet Chapel gets off. A woman thing perhaps"

The nature of the drug involved perhaps?
Posted by Is Mise, Tuesday, 23 December 2014 12:53:06 PM
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2 minds with a single thought Rehctub.
Posted by Hasbeen, Tuesday, 23 December 2014 12:56:46 PM
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If Indonesian President Jokowi wants to re-ignite tensions with Australia in 2015 then executing Australians by firing squad is his failure and miscalculation.

Indonesians who voted in President Jokowi don't want him to become a puppet of the Indonesian military and Indonesia's hardline fascists.
Posted by plantagenet, Tuesday, 23 December 2014 2:49:19 PM
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Happy Hanukkah (December 16, 2014) and Merry Christmas David Singer

Yes Monis the Bastard, Rapist and Murderer

Was consciously serving the interests of "Islamic" State.
Posted by plantagenet, Tuesday, 23 December 2014 3:03:36 PM
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Previous post mistaken.

Whoops wrong thread!!

Still, glad tidings for the New Year
Posted by plantagenet, Tuesday, 23 December 2014 3:06:01 PM
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I can see a time coming when we in the west re-introduce capital punishment. There are certainly many criminals who don't deserve any clemency from us taxpayers, who are, at present, forced to fund their continuing imprisonment. I, for one, object to financing the likes of Martin Bryant for the rest of his natural life!

I grant that most Australians oppose the death penalty. We have grown soft, many have religious objections, (Christians, not Moslems), and many others give examples of people executed and later found to be innocent. With very little thought, one can greatly minimize most of the objections, for example, executing only mass murderers, traitors, and drug pushers.
Posted by Beaucoupbob, Wednesday, 24 December 2014 6:20:59 AM
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Well, to begin with, Duncan, I don't consider Chan and Sukumaran to be "Australians" anyway. They are just foreigners who have barged into our country and declared war on our children. This was courtesy of our stupid immigration and refugee policies, the same policies which which allowed mad Man Monis Haris into Australia to kill our people in the Lindt café.

But it is nice to see that Muslims don't have any problem with the death penalty. Perhaps as a cultural group they may have a positive affect on Australia after all. An aversion to getting your hands dirty with a bit of blood to protect your own people is a uniquely western concept.

My own opinions towards Indonesia will improve markedly when Indonesia shoots those two scumbags. The Indos are doing what we in the west are too high minded to do ourselves. If we are smart enough to begin genetically eradicating our worse criminals, perhaps we could "outsource" the job to Indonesia? We are "outsourcing" every other productive job, so I don't see any problem with having Indonesia get rid of our own scumbags. Ivan Milat should be first on the list.
Posted by LEGO, Wednesday, 24 December 2014 1:55:31 PM
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I'm not a fan of capital punishment because of some practical concerns, mostly around lack of cinfidence in police and legal sytems to act honestly.

I've not seen any reason to think that in the case of the Bali nine there is any doubt about guilt. Nor any reason to think it was a spur/heat of the moment action. Rather a premeditated choice to take a massive risk in violation of the laws both here and in Indonesia and most if not all other countries.

As I understand it only the organisers are facing the death penalty. It won't sour my views of Indonesia if the advertised penalty of drug smuggling is carried out. No partucular desire to see them dead but there are far more deserving cases around of those facing injustice than members of the Bali 9.

Perhaps I'm providing an example if the authors assertions about gender, I have been told I have hairy chest (and back). On the other hand it could be the authors attempts to tie some emotive triggers on this issue to masculinity are yet another example of sexist stereotyping.

R0bert
Posted by R0bert, Wednesday, 24 December 2014 3:34:44 PM
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Duncan,
Capital punishment exists in the larger democracies in the world, Indonesia and India, the more advanced, Japan, and the most democratic, the USA.

We in Australia have what may be called a binary electoral system whereby you can only successfully vote for the Coalition or Labour. If they happen to collude to abolish the death penalty then there is nothing much the average punter can do about it.

Unlike America, we don’t have citizen’s initiated referenda to pass legislation over the objections of our parliamentary “representatives”.

The inner city cognoscenti and eastern suburbs doctors’ wives will certainly lap up your report, but you may be on shaky ground if you think the average Australian shares your mercy for all, soft on crime, sentiments. Especially if, dare I say, you orientate most of your arguments towards the heart rather than the head.
Posted by Edward Carson, Wednesday, 31 December 2014 1:15:53 PM
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Duncan Graham: Australian-Indonesian relations threatened by executions.

No it's not. Only the PC, Greenies & Do-Gooders think that & why take any notice of those weirdos anyway. I applaud Indonesia's decision to execute these Drug Runners. No damage done at all. Australia should take a leaf out of their book. Anyone caught with illegal Drugs. String 'em up.

Anyone caught under the influence of illegal Drugs must be not covered by any sort of Medical Cover & must pay for the Hospital, Doctors, Nurses, Ambulance, Police Services & all Legal expenses out of their own pocket. Self inflicted no sympathy & I do understand..
Posted by Jayb, Friday, 2 January 2015 3:35:39 PM
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