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The Forum > Article Comments > Men in trouble > Comments

Men in trouble : Comments

By Andee Jones, published 24/10/2014

It isn't just the Barry Spurrs of the world. The male of the species is in deep trouble and he doesn't seem to have the foggiest notion why.

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SUBMISSION WITHOUT INFORMED CONSENT IS STILL RAPE!
[Do you feel like it?
No?
Okay, do you mind laying down while I have one?]
And I dare say this happens in many more relationships, than we care to believe!
Therefore the claim of fifty percent, just doesn't seem that unreasonable!?
Yeah sure, we men know we're in charge, but not as some kind of boss whose word is law; just a very consultative team leader, and then only when a critical and timely decision must be made by someone.
Simply put, most men, the sensible ones,(MAN UP) wind up doing what they're told?
I used to drink beer, eat baked beans and or, B-B-Q'd steak and pass plentiful wind.
Try doing it into a didg, it's a gasser.
Can't do that anymore, given the gas seems to often have (oops) lumps in it.
What do you do when there's an oops in your life?
Today, it'S go home, take a shower and change the undies.
[Real men don't eat quiche and real women don't pump gas! And complete nonsense, quiche is great grub.]
That said, many men are now completely confused as to what their proper role is?
And more and more of them are shying away from long term commitment, and fatherhood!
I don't know what the answer is; but for either sex, it's not being a doormat for the other half, nor losing your cool over compete trivialities; nor shirking a fair share of a common workload!
Or having shouldered an unfair share of it, being too continually tired to have CONSENSUAL sex; the glue/love bond, that binds most heterosexual relationships!
Better you menfolk shoulder a more than fair share.
Cook a meal, (candle lit dinner) run her a bath, replete with bath oil, potpourri and a glass or two of her favorite wine; play her favorite mood music; and then have to put up with an energetic and "interested" lady, coming on to you, hands all over you and demanding her, (thank you sweetheart) conjugal rights!
WOW! Now that's what I call a relationship.
Rhrosty.
Posted by Rhrosty, Friday, 24 October 2014 12:28:24 PM
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Hi Pete, Andee here. Thanks for your feedback. Just a couple of things:

First, you seem to have misread the sentence or two about the data from the Asia-Pacific study. What I'm actually saying is that, of the 10,000 men interviewed across the region, on average, one in every four admitted to having raped a woman or girl. Half of the men who admitted to raping, that is, the perpetrators (NOT half of the respondents) said they raped for fun, entertainment, or out of boredom. Three-quarters of the perpetrators said they raped because as men they were entitled to take what was rightfully theirs, including women's bodies. (The men entered the most sensitive data anonymously.)

I trust that every non-violent man would be appalled by these findings. My point is that all those good men need to stand up to the violent minority. The violent men do not listen to women; they only listen to men they respect.

Perhaps the quote in my next post (I am exceeding the word limit here) will communicate my take-home message. The piece, 'All Good Men' was written in response to the early ADF-top-brass claims that male violence is 'just human nature.' Of course all humans are capable of violence, which is why the rule of law is essentially saying, 'Yep, understand you were pissed off. Nup, you shouldn't have punched him out.'

Hope that makes things a bit clearer. Thanks again for your comments.
Andee
Posted by imho, Friday, 24 October 2014 1:52:58 PM
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Just following up my previous post, here's the extract from 'All Good Men' by A. Jones (in 'Joining the Dots: Essays and Opinion 2011-2014')

'Self-assured men reject the spin that ‘real men’ must always be one-up in their relationships with women and that womanly attributes are weak and inferior. They’ve learned from their mothers, sisters, partners or daughters that women are people too. In spite of these men’s cultural conditioning, they’ve learned that women, like men, have their own thoughts, experiences and feelings and want to be in charge of their own lives and projects.

It is these reconstructed men, particularly in the military, who must go further and start telling their unreconstructed mates that their abusive behaviour is unacceptable. It takes guts for a man to stand up to another man who is putting women down. He knows he could be labelled ‘homo’ or ‘pussy-whipped’ or thumped for his trouble. Yet the men who do find the courage will have an enormous impact on the problem. To paraphrase anti-violence educator Jackson Katz (2006), the rates of abuse will plummet when men start telling other men to stop their sexist behaviour, that is, when the chauvinists start losing status among their peers.

Blaming human nature for a seriously sick culture is a cop out. There’s work to be done. And just as it takes a village to raise a child, it takes a community to change a culture. It’s time for all good men to lend a hand.'
Posted by imho, Friday, 24 October 2014 1:55:28 PM
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Hi Pete
You are missing the point of the article and what it actually says. You are interpreting it in a way that shows you have not understood it. There is no point in me trying to explain it to you. Why? Because you want to believe that your misreading is correct. How do I know? Because you are up in arms over what it doesn't say.

How about reading this article on how domestic violence was massively reduced in Uganda. http://truth-out.org/news/item/27008-violence-against-women-can-be-stopped-if-everyone-is-invested-in-preventing-abuse

"Underpinning high rates of violence in many parts of the world are beliefs that it is an acceptable, even necessary part of life. “I have come face to face with many men who thought that controlling their partners and disciplining them whenever necessary was normal,” says Tina Musuya who heads the centre’s team. “I heard many community members say that violence was expected, it’s a private matter and a sign of love and that I shouldn’t meddle in people’s private lives.”

Designed by Raising Voices, a Ugandan NGO, the SASA! intervention mobilises whole communities to challenge these norms that make women vulnerable to both violence and HIV, and to address the imbalance of power between men and women that legitimises men’s control of women, limits women’s power to refuse sex or insist on condom use, and leads communities to turn a blind eye to violence."

Anger and anyone abusing power harms both the victim and the abuser power. Have a look at these books:

Somebodies and nobodies by Robert Fuller
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/somebodies-and-nobodies/200908/somebodies-and-nobodies-understanding-rankism

Or watch Jackson Katz:
http://www.ted.com/talks/jackson_katz_violence_against_women_it_s_a_men_s_issue?language=en

Have a look at Joe Bageant on how people have been manipulated into supporting positions that undermine them. They are encouraged to believe in the stereotypes they are given rather than work out what is really going on and where the power is:

http://www.abc.net.au/tv/bigideas/stories/2010/10/05/3027543.htm

Hope you find one of these links interesting.
Posted by lillian, Friday, 24 October 2014 2:31:16 PM
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What a pile of utter garbage.

Ten thousand men across the Asia-Pacific region, Andee says, but carefully avoids telling us if that was the PNG highlands, or backward parts of India. Without such qualification the whole thing is just so much meaningless rubbish.

Of course I suppose it depends on the company you keep, whether you find this stuff believable. Not having been part of a university academic community, as Andee obviously has, I wouldn't know if he found these figures reflected his experience there.

Why is it that these people have to produce such obviously biased rubbish. Surely it would be better to do something useful.
Posted by Hasbeen, Friday, 24 October 2014 3:43:00 PM
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Andee your article is garbage, sorry to be blunt but those of us who inhabit the plane we call "reality" know better.
The views and actions of men in Suva or Rabaul, Wadeye or South Auckland are irrelevant to life in mainstream Australia, there's no similarity between men of different races, the European might as well be a different species to the Melanesian or Polynesian since we have very little in common save gender.
There's no epidemic of violence in Australia, women are assaulted at the rate of 500 per 100,000 and men at a rate of 800 per 100,000 which is vastly lower than many other countries in the region, if you excluded intra-Aboriginal violence the problem virtually disappears in the mainstream.
Posted by Jay Of Melbourne, Friday, 24 October 2014 4:36:34 PM
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