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The Forum > Article Comments > Building in the wreckage: the reconstruction of Christian theology > Comments

Building in the wreckage: the reconstruction of Christian theology : Comments

By Peter Sellick, published 9/4/2014

Such a theology would abandon any idea that the thinking individual may come to clear and certain truths by means of his own reason. Descartes' promise has turned out to be absurd.

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Peter

Thanks for another thought-provoking piece and a constructive one, explaining where you think theology should go as well as what is currently wrong with it!

While I have great respect for Barth, I wonder if his theology is a little too circular in its reasoning and referencing. Perhaps we can’t argue the existence of a creator from the existence of creation (though St. Paul might disagree – Romans 1:20). But to entirely separate theology from other means of human knowing ultimately denies the meaningfulness of free will or the proposal that humanity is created in God’s image. Bonhoeffer’s famous critique of Barth, that he proposed a “positivist doctrine of revelation”, seems to me to have merit.
Posted by Rhian, Wednesday, 9 April 2014 2:46:51 PM
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IF THERE IS A WRECK-AGE..
'the church/is stepping away from
at least look honestly at this first step

<<..My suggestion was..that far from opposing..the conclusion that god does not exist..[as a being in the universe,]..>

that dont mean the holy spirit isnt being all being
[ie just because jesus isnt god..dont mean that god didnt sustain jesus his living[indeed that jesus was jesus because he lived knowing it was gods will he live

its ridiculous to say gos dont exist[he is the sun]
the bible say we cannot look upon him and live[and looking at the sun/will burn ya blind..not to mention sunburn.

so having given away/god..what else ya giving up..on
would you that jesus/god or the holy spirit/gave up on you?

<<..the Church should recognize its truth>>

GOD IS THE SUN/SCIENCE SAYS SO
AND SCIENCE IS RIGHT..[OK WE KNOW JESUS ISNT GOD..
BUT WE ALSO KNOW GOD Exists=the sun/but by tossing god..ya toss out the holy spirit..too

<<.. and that in the modern era it has,;by and large, built its theology on false foundations.>>

the corner stone of the church is peter/peter is sound
the other corner stoner is jesus..god and the holy spirit
[just admit..the holy spirit thing/and we forgive you saying god dont exist

ye shall have none before the sun of the holy spirit
ye can blaspheme the sun but not deney/the holy living spirit sustaining all living as per emmanual[god with[in]..us..[all]

<<For example theology cannot begin with an attempt to prove the existence of God from nature or logic>>

cause science has done the science

<<..i.e...the existence of God cannot be built on foundations external..to the God..that Christians worship>>

THE HOLY SPIRIT SUSTAINS LIFE FROM WITH-IN

<<...>>If we do this we only get an abstraction of our own making that essentially leaves the field to atheism.

THEY DONT want it
Too many of you already saying god don't exist
thats their line..not yours..yours is look there is god
here is jesus who showed us the holy living spirit/within/god without.

you sure your working for jesus
well rebuild his church/ya on the wrong team
Posted by one under god, Wednesday, 9 April 2014 2:51:15 PM
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another glaring error/quote..<<...Anti-foundationalist theology recognizes..that when evidence..for..the existence of God..is found apart from God revealing Himself..to humanity..then the living God that Christians worship is lost.>>

thats hypnotized you..into thinking god isnt revealing his greatness to you every second of your life.refusing to see the bleeding obvious.

see the light/from the sun..god is revealing himself
see that leaf growing that bird chirping..that rat gnoring/the dog snoring/sight seen in gods light..reveals YOUR Seeing[see by your sight]

you hear some vibrations/you hear others
god opens your sensES..but you say no he hasnt revealed himself

well prove HE HAS CONCEALED?
GOD ISNT HIDING..science says we came from the sun
indeed let there be light life love logic/your seeing hearing smelling god everywhere inside of every..living thing..your the teacher/but its the blind leading the blind..bad service is disservice

<<..The great Swiss theologian,>>was a fool..<<< Karl Barth understood this and refused..>>..to see the winess of gods creation..lol..

[i see nuthin..no<<..evidence from nature as a support for the existence of God>>..thats purely insane..gods work/has his mark on it

i looked upon gods face[once]..the sun didnt blind me
in fact i saw it with the eyes of a child/saw 'god'/looks like an engorged nipple/just squirting out life force/light..upon his creation.

i saw how a baby..sukkles readily upon seeing the nipple
the nipple..is in gods image..[the sun and its carolla...aerola

[ohh la la]..the father..looks like a nipple
little wonder the sages couldnt LOOK UPON HIS FAce

so you see how you been decieved
nature reflects gods creative instinct/know the artist/by knowing your masters handiwork/all natural creation/that unatural is of man/beast tide.wind..that sUPRA-NATURAL..your missing altogether/a native with his fetish..is closer to god than you

get ye behind me satan
your betraying your calling..you deny god
yet you enjoy and get fat from his suK

HE SHAKES HIS HEAD..let..the dead tend the dead.
Posted by one under god, Wednesday, 9 April 2014 7:43:15 PM
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Rhian,
It is good to see someone coming to grips with my stuff instead of brushing it of in a superficial fashion.
I do not think I or Barth are for dismissing all other knowledge. It is just that we agree (with the gospel of John) that the proper study of God is the study of Christology. I would look for a reversal of how we see relationships in this. It is not the world that illuminates the gospel but the gospel that illuminates the world. Since the Enlightenment it has been the former and the result is that we have made God into an object that we can inspect. This disastrous loss of transcendence has made us into titans who walk the earth but have little understanding of what our lives might be about.

This has been described as a shift from ontology in which Being is central to function or causation and outcome being central.

I have heard of Bonhoeffer's criticism and have read Barth's response, he did not seem to see the point.
Posted by Sells, Wednesday, 9 April 2014 11:30:27 PM
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"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell
Posted by Grim, Thursday, 10 April 2014 7:09:48 AM
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SELLS-SELL/swell/..quote..<<..it is just..that we agree>>

but..its just you..in the know..agreeing
that you more clever than we..agree..[agree to speak..in code]

<<>.(with the gospel of John)..>>
where..in johns gopil/1john..jon/john..john 1..thats the clever one[see your missing on how to communicate/with others not as 'wise'/privileged .educated.voiced..in abstractions..as you/why even bother posting openly..just speak/in latin/be done..with the fictions based on names...opinions..its rote clap..trap/pap

you agree/john/which one..
they are numbed/if you wanted to...'be'..clear/you could be..

john/somewhere/somehow..is said/To have..said<<>.that the proper study of God .is the study of Christology.>>

thats plainly absurd..[ignoring the perversion..of john..1]
god created//jesus..in year zero/not..'in the beginning'[god created the word-world..[whats the problem..with quoting chapter/verse?[you couldnt do any worse/than..your double-speak..you use/now.

<<..I would look..for..a reversal..of how..we see relationships..in this.>>[john this..or..the other commentator..on this/THAT..WHAT?

<<>>It is not the world..that illuminates..the gospel..but..the gospel that illuminates..the world.>>

lol..says him who confounds./the world with elite word/exclusive secret gnosis/speaking..in names-code/to the over educated...living in the artifice..of word construction/dead word..ignoring gods living creation

worldly satiatio..wordy..con granulation
[its mutual-masturbation..wordy mastication]

<<Since..the Enlightenment..>
it has..only gotten darker

<<..it has been...the former>>

former lightness.or former darkness..or
forming informing reforming..deforming..that..of the/true former..or form

[has?]..been/former,,<<..and..the result..is
that...we have made God..[lol]..into an object..[word?].that we can inspect.>>

god..is the sun/we are examining her/
BUT What else..would we expect..but..inspect..her work.
science knows..life was begat..from the sun/get over the other junk/

lift the scales..off ya eyes/you can ignore me/but dont ignore the graceful mercy/of the living light..sustaining your life

<<>.This disastrous..loss of transcendence>>
ohhh..dear/lord..<<..has made us into titans>>

in thine own minds

<<..who walk the earth..but..lol
have little understanding..of what our lives..might be about...>>

jesus wept..
i say to you;...
love one and other/by works..not words..[its not rocket/science]

but i forget...you live in the realm...of WORDY/WORLD-theory...[of words wrote by names]..forgetting the fool..confounds the wise in their own eyes..

<<>>This has been described..as a shift..from ontology..in which Being.[what?]..is central...to function or causation..and outcome being central.>>

if only..you knew/what..you
just parroted..back...was huge..[when it/was..first written]

<<.I have heard..of Bonhoeffer's criticism...and
[u]..have read..Barth's response,..he did not..seem to see..the point>..either

and...because he didnt..you cant?
or wont?..
have you read kant?
Posted by one under god, Thursday, 10 April 2014 7:53:21 AM
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