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The Forum > Article Comments > The slippery slope > Comments

The slippery slope : Comments

By Adam Henry, published 21/1/2014

Political spin of both major parties would now have us believe that the billions of dollars spent on detention centres and off shore processing have only ever been about territorial sovereignty and a moral crusade to prevent people drowning at sea.

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...I can't believe people "out there" think like this author!
Posted by diver dan, Tuesday, 21 January 2014 9:19:03 AM
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Yes, the delusion is strong in this one. Activists seem to live in an alternative reality that allows them to see themselves as right and good, and assume everyone who disagrees - in this case all the ALP & supporters PLUS all the Coalition and supporters - are so wrong and even evil. This act of manufacturing grounds for a belief is common when the original reasons for supporting it have failed.

Of course, following the ideas of this delusional minority is what led to the disasters since 2007 - tens of thousands locked up in detention, billions of wasted money, over a thousand believed dead at sea, and the ALP government shorn of any hope of re-election as they writhed in useless activity, damaging themselves more at every turn.

Yes, any government should be listening to this Adam Henry and his fellow travellers.
Posted by ChrisPer, Tuesday, 21 January 2014 10:20:50 AM
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“The betrayal of human rights in East Timor (and elsewhere) by both sides of Australian politics…”.

Both sides of Australian politics are betraying their own country and voters; human rights in East Timor are none of their business; nor are the opinions of this author and a NSW state politician on the Pinochet regime.

The previous government, and now the current government, are guilty of betraying Australia in the matter of the main gripe of Adam Henry’s article: border protection. Abbott, when questioned on TV recently about his silence on how well or not his promise to ‘stop the boats’ is going, compared his secrecy on the matter with the secrecy needed around operations at a time of war. The only thing to be said about that pathetic defence for his silence is this: if Abbott or any other of our shiftless and untrustworthy politicians conducted a war the way they have mismanaged the border protection issue, Australia would be overrun and under enemy management in less than a week. And don’t forget the other betrayal of Australia by politicians – the outrageous reduction in defence spending and the waste of troops in useless, meaningless actions in Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan.

Australian politicians should not be spending huge sums of taxpayer money on housing illegal entrants and saving them for drowning at sea. Henry finds this to be “punitive”; well it’s not punitive; it comes no where near being punitive. The namby-pamby way all Australian politicians have mismanaged the border protection/illegal boats situation is purely and simply a betrayal of their country and people. If Abbott keeps his nerve – and if he is really turning back the boats behind his veil of silence – that’s the way to go. No one coming by boat ever touches Australian soil, and to hell with Indonesia bleating about their sovereignty; start thinking about our sovereignty and the ongoing assaults on it by illegals coming from Indonesia.

As for “political tensions with Indonesia”: phooey! They are a mendicant, uncooperative state, taking our money.
Posted by NeverTrustPoliticians, Tuesday, 21 January 2014 11:35:19 AM
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Don't worry, Adam, nobody believes politicians. We already know that their only motive is to stay in power and provide lavish jobs for their family and comrades.

As for the asylum seekers, obviously we should not be paying all that money to detain them. All we need is to:

1. Return Christmas Island to Singapore.
2. Not interfere with those coming by boat - neither help nor obstruct. If they drown, they drown.
3. Send the people on those boats that do make the distance to Australia to Tasmania, which already declared that they are welcome there.
4. Those asylum seekers who do not pose a health/criminal risk, may live and work in Tasmania while their requests are processed, provided they find sponsors that are willing to place an appropriate bond on their good behaviour and not leaving Tasmania.
5. Those assessed as genuine refugees, receive a visa that allows them to remain and work in Tasmania permanently.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Tuesday, 21 January 2014 12:59:14 PM
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This article is the best reason I have yet seen for closing down the Social Sciences, Department of History at the ANU.

In fact if this is the sort of garbage it is producing, it is a damn good reason for closing the whole outfit down. It is obviously doing more harm than good.
Posted by Hasbeen, Tuesday, 21 January 2014 1:16:04 PM
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As I read the comments above, I feel incredibly sad that the writers apparently gained nothing decent and moral from whatever short time they spent in an educational institution. It is apparent that reading for comprehension was a subject that all failed. The article is about a noticeable decline in the standard of journalism in Australia.

The author was probably mistaken in even mentioning “asylum seekers” as all the usual suspects leapt into action, spilling their usual bile and venom and completely missing the point. The author used the example of asylum seekers to demonstrate the narrowing and limiting of reasonable discussion about any major issue. Instead of a polite, deep and considered discussion, we hear instead populist slogans and, usually misinformed, rants where the ranter shows both ignorance of the topic under discussion and a complete unwillingness to listen to any other person.

I look forward to the day that there can be a calm and considered discussion of this and other issues where people keep to the topic, do not go off ranting about side issues and the comments of all are valued and appreciated.

I don’t think I’m likely to get it here, but you never know.
Posted by Brian of Buderim, Tuesday, 21 January 2014 3:42:29 PM
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Brian
In a much wider view education controlled by Leftwing goverments at state level for most of the past 20 years is the cause of the destruction of our once fabled egalitarisam, where everybodys view regardless of statwus, wealth or education was respected. We once knew nobody held all truth and everybody held part of the truth.

It is time we returned to those values and dumped the current crap about education being the be all and end all and font of all wisdom. Clearly it isn't.
Posted by imajulianutter, Tuesday, 21 January 2014 4:43:02 PM
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Nutter,
What connection does your incorrect rant have with the topic of the diminishing quality and narrowing focus of the mainstream media?
Posted by Brian of Buderim, Tuesday, 21 January 2014 5:03:05 PM
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Brian,

Although Adam starts his piece discussing the manipulation of mainstream media he does devote a lot of his article to the asylum seeker issue and from my reading of his article he is expressing an opinion about the issue itself.

Adam, I agree with your analysis regarding the manipulation of mainstream media but I would add that manipulation can be driven by the media organisations themselves.

If you remember back to the Keating era when mandatory detention was established there was an infamous scene at the Port Hedland detention centre where family members of a refugee were shown on national TV crying out to their relatives separated by the perimeter fence. As Robert Tickner explained in an interview later if the TV camera had only panned out a little it would have shown detention officials standing alongside an open gate not far away. That was a deliberate attempt by the media in that case to manipulate an image.

As to the current debate I think it has descended into an acrimonious debate over how these people arrive and I think more focus should be devoted to the causes driving these people to seek asylum. War and persecution to me are symptoms of much more fundamental issues surrounding the low status of women in the source countries.

So in the context of a calm and considered broader discussion Brian and Adam how do you suggest we address these patriarchal attitudes, particularly with recent arrivals intent on maintaining these traditions in Australia?
Posted by Farquhar, Tuesday, 21 January 2014 6:28:43 PM
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I was around, Adam Henry, when Chile elected in a stupid communist government which immediately "nationalised" the means of production and sent Chile bankrupt. The economy effectively collapsed and the population became desperate. Just like in Turkey and Egypt, the Chilean armed forces were a lot smarter than their stupid, ideologically driven government, and they kicked the commos out.

I remember the images on TV of the Chilean middle classes sitting on the balcony of the stock exchange sipping wine and cheering on the Chilean Air Force Sabre jets who were bombing the palace.

I don't care if the armed forces then rounded up the morons who had sent their country bankrupt and even knocked few of them off. Communists were hardly paragons of virtue in that department themselves, so if the commos got what they have been routinely dished to their political opponents everywhere else, I really don't care. Chile is now a reasonably successful South American country and you only have to compare it to Cuba to figure out what what Pinochet did was the right thing to do.
Posted by LEGO, Tuesday, 21 January 2014 7:50:04 PM
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Brian of Buderim, whenever one of your posts appears on my computer, the arrogance drips off the screen, & runs all over my desk.

You must be an academic. Only academics can develop so much arrogance with so little justification.
Posted by Hasbeen, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 10:21:55 AM
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Sorry for this "Hasbeen", but you do leave the door open here! Are you sure the substance dripping from your PC screen and all over your desk actually originates from Brian (namely from the other side of the screen)? Judging by your comment it seems very likely (in a number of possible scientific explanations regarding this unfortunate substance suddenly dripping from your screen and onto your desk), that this substance may actually originate from somewhere on your side of the screen. Just an observation of course!
Posted by Issac Brock, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 11:21:12 AM
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For LEGO: Fascism - (in general use) extreme right-wing, authoritarian, or intolerant views or practices.

Thought this (above) might be of some interest to you. I would suspect that you yourself would not be a fascist (this would require a dedicated commitment and political discipline which would publicly identify one as such). Often quite unpopular for some "odd" historical reasons! It might be worth noting that a little further to the right of spectrum the tendencies you demonstrate in your comments have been embraced. Pinochet (obviously a bit of a hero of yours) was quite the supporter of such extreme tendencies and in practice. Fond of torturing and killing all sorts of people too, not merely those evil communists. I did enjoy the comparison of Cuba and Chile. I can see why keeping open a history department full of researchers etc would be a very low priority for you. But I wonder LEGO, when you look to the enemy on the 'wrong' side of where you sit on the standard political spectrum there must be a disturbingly high number of left wingers/communists/do gooders out there. I do wonder, is there actually an abnormally high percentage of horrid left wingers/do gooders out there? Or is it that you sit so far to the right of the political spectrum that you are actually closer to Pinochet in philosophy and sympathies than say Malcolm Fraser (one of those well known left-wing maniacs)?
Posted by Issac Brock, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 11:45:16 AM
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The article is not about the media. It is a muddle, an opportunity to bang on about refugees and people whose ideas the writer finds icky. It is about himself, his ego and his self-righteousness.
Posted by ChrisPer, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 2:10:21 PM
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Ok, so is it more or less of the said 'muddle' in comparison to your own written observations? How exactly are you yourself 'immune' from the terrible flaws you highlight about this author? It is hard to see that you would wish to post anything, would it not be too 'egotistical' and too 'self righteous'?
Posted by Issac Brock, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 4:11:03 PM
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Hi Adam and Farquhar,
My apologies for not replying earlier: I was very involved in other issues.
May I suggest a three way conversation on this thread, ignoring the trolls, the LNP shills, and the ignorant?
Posted by Brian of Buderim, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 9:53:05 PM
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I rest my case.
Posted by Hasbeen, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 10:22:38 PM
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My dear Hasbeen. You 'rest your case'? I do believe in the traditional way of resting one's case, you actually need to make a case/argument in the first place. Just a thought.

I umm, 'rest my case'!
Posted by Issac Brock, Saturday, 25 January 2014 8:43:43 PM
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