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The Forum > Article Comments > In Syria the 'London Eleven' need help from heaven > Comments

In Syria the 'London Eleven' need help from heaven : Comments

By David Singer, published 24/9/2013

Only divine intervention now seems likely to justify continuing support for the anti- Assad forces in Syria by the group known as the London 11.

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To my thinking, the immediate concern here is whether or not the US will allow Russia to show the world a way out of the Syrian civil war. Will the US act the spoiler to deny Russia what will be seen as a clear "win"? Is the US big enough to stand down, to get off Assad's back?
The bigger question would be is Obama strong enough to resist pressure from the Zionists to continue the march to Tehran thru the suburbs of Damascus?
Iran remains the key. I was heartened to read in today's press that the EU foreign policy chief Catherine Ashton has announced fresh talks with Iran. http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/latest-news/iran-world-powers-to-hold-nuke-talks-eu/story-fn3dxix6-1226725651641
Are we ready to finally give diplomacy a chance? I hope so. Iran seems ready. Is the West?
Posted by halduell, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 8:01:44 AM
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Ah Yes its that snappy chappie member of the Israeli propaganda dept(possibly unpaid) Mr Singer,giving advice about Arabs suffering from the result of the Sykes/Picot agreement,and the Balfour agreement which set up Israeli.
As for what is happening in Syria,and your advice I think you would be better served cleaning up the Israeli/Settler treatment of the Palestinians,Who I know you think don't exist,than offering advice on another country's problems.
Or you could ask you Good friends in the Dept how many A bombs the
govt have how many chemical weapons they have and try being honest for once
Posted by John Ryan, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 9:57:02 AM
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You have to give it to Singer. He has enlarged the scope of his thinking and is now an expert on the whole of the Middle East as well as an apologist and white-washer for the rogue nation of Israel.

How long will it take him to enlarge his scope even further and give us his grand prognostications on the whole world? How long will it take him to contact Putin and Obama and tell them where they got it wrong?

Will he be elected to run the U.N. in a few months? Will he become the Head of the New World Order and sit at Obama's right hand?

One thing you could never accuse the Singer of is humility or lack of ambition!
Posted by David G, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 10:32:48 AM
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It would have been useful if the author had offered insights concerning Israel's attitudes and policies regarding the Syrian situation.

Israel is the most powerful country in the region and also one of Syria's neighbours.

In the absence of mention of Israel, one can only assume Israel supports the anti-Assad forces, including the jihadists.
Posted by plantagenet, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 11:59:58 AM
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To #halduell, #John Ryan, #David G, #plantagenet

You all share a remarkable characteristic - total disregard and lack of any compassion for the suffering of the Syrian population which has seen at least 110000 killed and seven million citizens displaced over the last thirty months.

My article puts forward a proposal that could see the conflict ended.

Do you agree with it or disagree? Do you have an alternative? Do you care?

#plantagenet - the insight I can offer regarding Israel's attitudes and policies are encapsulated in the following article:

http://www.haaretz.com/news/middle-east/1.547807

Shame on all of you
Posted by david singer, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 1:43:17 PM
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'To #halduell, #John Ryan, #David G, #plantagenet '

yes the hatred of the only democracy in the middle east is amazing but not surprising. it fits with their very narrow world view.
Posted by runner, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 2:09:15 PM
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Hi David Singer,

Your frustration at the juvenile, ill informed, proselytizing, groupthink, anti-everything brigade is understandable. This used to be a forum for debate, argument and substantiation. It is now reduced to a twitter/Facebook level blog for the disenfranchised and those who cannot form their own opinion and are relegated to adopting someone else’s.

Note for Graham Young. You are killing off your own Forum.

In all the years I have contributed to this Forum, I have never seen so much trash being presented as “dialogue”. We are all entitled to an opinion, this is not about suppression of free speech but it is about balance and encouraging thinking people to challenge the considered opinions of others.

David, I don’t have to agree with you or to respond with the opinion of others; I’ve already made it clear that I do not agree with western military intervention in the M.E. or North Africa. My view is to pull our aid and let them get on with it or align themselves with Russia and China. Let them have the problems and criticism for a change.

I do however think it is time for GY to review the balance of contributors, their commitment to analysis, considered review of their positions and the injection of adult conversation rather than the angry, twitter level responses of the socially isolated link wars.

OLO has been usurped by juvenile, reactionary rubbish. I now have difficulty finding anything I can relate to as an argument, let alone feel inclined to respond to. Threads go for single unit responses, if you are lucky they go to tens of responses. History shows this to be a significant change against the trend.

GY, sorry but you are failing your once majority of thinking contributors. This is a classic case of “Fairfax Syndrome”. Please fix it before OLO becomes totally insignificant. Your propensity for publishing so many weak, social, group think platitudes is evident by the number of your best contributors walking away from OLO.
Posted by spindoc, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 3:31:49 PM
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Hi David Singer

I fear I have been somewhat disingenuous, already having a handle on the complexity of Israel's several views on Syria.

Stepping back a bit, we as Australian's have little idea how bad it would be if a neighbour (for arguments sake Indonesia) had 1,100 tons of chemical weapons, but then Indonesia disintegrated from a reliable, though hostile, secular dictatorship into an Islamic extremist free for all. Fortunately Indonesia has no CWs and after Suharto it re-established itself in the direction of stable democracy. But Syria on Israel's doorstep is unfortunately not like Indonesia.

Thanks for the Haaretz article http://www.haaretz.com/news/middle-east/1.547807. It indicates the humanitarian side of Israel. There are of course many sides.

Regarding Israel's more Realpolitik attitudes to Syria the website of the (Israeli) Institute of National Security Studies (INSS) is very useful (see http://www.inss.org.il/publications.php?cat=21&incat=&read=11464 )

An article (INSS Insight No. 427, May 19, 2013) by Professor Itamar Rabinovich, Vice Chairman of the INSS Board of Directors, former president of Tel Aviv University and a former Israeli ambassador to Washington reveals the complexity of Israel's attitudes - see http://dno8g1zsiv2fs.cloudfront.net/upload/(FILE)1368963793.pdf .

Basically the attitude of the "Pentagon official" that you quote, David, is similar to Professor Rabinovich's.

I'll comment soon on what was in your article, David, rather than what wasn't :)

Regards

Pete
Posted by plantagenet, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 4:06:23 PM
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CONTINUED

The pdf for Professor Rabinovich's article (INSS Insight No. 427, May 19, 2013) doesn't seem to work.

It is currently on the INSS site at http://www.inss.org.il/publications.php?cat=21&incat=&read=11464&page=4 and failing that on my own website at http://gentleseas.blogspot.com.au/2013/05/israels-realpolitikal-concern-about.html

Regards

Pete
Posted by plantagenet, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 4:19:29 PM
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#spindoc

Thanks for your comments regarding the mindless characters who continually pop up with expected regularity to vent their Jew hatred without any effort to address the issues raised in my articles.

I could have their vicious posts excluded from OLO - but take the view that people like them should be exposed for what they are.

The point you make that others may be driven away from OLO because of these ratbags is certainly worth considering.

Do other contributors to OLO feel the same way?

#To plantagenet

I'm sorry that you have had to admit to being disingenuous. Of course Israel's position in relation to Syria was not the subject of my article - and it was mischievous of you to raise it as you did.

We have a civil war in Syria in which eleven nations are involved in aiding the rebels and two nations and a terrorist group are aiding Assad. Surely we need to focus on the issues and complexities these countries have involved themselves in and how they can get out of the quagmire into which Syria has been plunged.

I looked at your web page and it seems to attempt to raise many issues in a responsible manner.

Why do you run it anonymously
Posted by david singer, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 5:56:39 PM
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Dear Graham Young, let me congratulate you on the progress of your greatly improved Forum now that the brain-dead right-wingers are no longer in the ascendancy.

Some of them are still boring us with their ideological ramblings which seem to derive from Mein Kampf!

When I first started contributing, to say anything negative about the U.S. was ignored. Then it was attacked. Now, more frequently, people are saying what they really think about the U.S. and its warmongering imperialism.

A Forum should be about discussing ideas, different ideas, new ideas, rather than becoming a place where black and white views are rehashed over and over by woefully pedestrian minds to the point of tedium.

More power to you, Graham, and keep up the good work!

P.S. Including a few more ICH articles would really get the ire of the right-wingers and the traditionalists! They might even start thinking!
Posted by David G, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 7:03:41 PM
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David Singer,

I'm also somewhat amazed by your expression of compassion for the displaced and oppressed Arab populations of Syria. In order to ease your moral anguish why don't you describe them as "Syrians", then they, like the Palestinians, won't exist, it's simple isn't it?

The obvious explanation is that the Zionists, and their US patron, prefer Assad's regime to a hundred thousand jihadi psychopaths next door. All that effort to get rid of Morsi and the Moslem Brotherhood, then an even nastier horde of barbarians is about to conquer Syria.
Posted by mac, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 7:26:22 PM
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David G

"now that the brain-dead right-wingers are no longer in the ascendancy."

Well, actually, now they're the government.
Posted by mac, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 7:32:08 PM
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Is it legal for me to buy two crates of 7.62x39 bullets from the Horsley Park gun shop and send a crate to each side? I feel it is my patriotic duty.

This is the most wonderful outcome the West could have hoped for. We should keep stoking the fire and let our Muslim terrorist enemies kill each other off.
Posted by LEGO, Tuesday, 24 September 2013 7:39:39 PM
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Singer, which Heaven do the Eleven (that rhymes) need help from?

Is it the Jewish Heaven, reserved only for the racist Children of God?

Or does it also include the Gentile Heaven where inferior folk end up?

Perhaps you mean the Muslim Heaven replete with virgins?

Take a moment to enlighten us, oh Eminent Sage of the Age!
Posted by David G, Wednesday, 25 September 2013 12:58:47 PM
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Hi David Singer

An interesting article. The unnamed Pentagon official you cite provides a fair reflection of US misgivings since the Syrian conflict began. The US Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General Dempsey has also voiced misgiving over the possible open ended nature of supplying the Syrian opposition or any US military intervention.

Your are right to point out the ineffectual strategy of the London Eleven which cannot agree on what types of support for the opposition would be appropriate. The US has been refusing to give the opposition anti-aircraft and anti-tank missiles while the Saudis and Qatar may be more willing to provide these potentially anti-Western weapons.

The fragmented nature of the opposition groups with substantial extremist elements, that you point to, may be severely weakening the military strength of these groups. This fragmentation also indicates that even if Assad was beaten civil war among the groups would continue.

The latest news is that the Syrian opposition has further fragmented:

"BEIRUT — Nearly a dozen of Syria’s powerful rebel factions, including one linked to al-Qaida, formally broke with the main opposition group in exile Wednesday [25 Sept 2013] and called for Islamic law in the country, dealing a severe blow to the Western-backed coalition."

see http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/un-chemical-weapons-inspectors-arrive-in-beirut-on-their-way-back-to-syria/2013/09/25/e0605eee-25a8-11e3-9372-92606241ae9c_story.html

Regards

Pete
Posted by plantagenet, Thursday, 26 September 2013 10:10:08 AM
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To #plantagenet

Many thanks for what has been the first constructive attempt in a long time by any poster to discuss the subject matter of my articles - rather than personally denigrate me or pursue an agenda of Jew -hatred that had nothing to do with the content of my articles..

The latest news pointed out by you indicates the trouble the London Eleven now find themselves in. It is not clear whether the Syrian Free Army has joined the new coalition. If they have not - then giving them asylum in the London Eleven countries has become even more urgent - if a massive bloodbath of their forces is to be averted.

If they have teamed up with the Islamist and jihad foreign fighters - Spare a thought for the civilian population still stuck in Syria who will be caught up in this latest power struggle for control of Syria.
Posted by david singer, Thursday, 26 September 2013 3:41:23 PM
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I was moved to tears when Singer said the following: "Spare a thought for the civilian population still stuck in Syria who will be caught up in this latest power struggle for control of Syria."

It's a shame he doesn't have the same deep caring for the Palestinians who are caught up in Israel's occupation/struggle for power in Gaza and the West Bank (and have been for many, many decades).

When Singer sheds crocodile tears for non-Israelis you know he's up to mischief, that he's as authentic as a two-bob watch!
Posted by David G, Thursday, 26 September 2013 3:54:25 PM
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Hi David G

Mate I think you've made Israel-great-satan points several times on this thread.

Rather than the ritualised denunciation going into detail on current issues like today's:

- http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-09-26/israel-to-ease-some-restrictions-on-gaza-strip/4981974
"Israel eases restrictions on Gaza Strip, West Bank as US steps up efforts for Middle East peace deal"

may show deeper interest.

I mean some people overseas never fail to mention how white Australia have treated aborigines. Such people seem to know little else about Australia.

Compared to all of its neighbours and many other countries Israel comes out fairly humanitarian. But life and politics are more complex than constant slurs.

Cheers

Pete
Posted by plantagenet, Thursday, 26 September 2013 6:46:43 PM
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"Compared to all of its neighbours and many other countries Israel comes out fairly humanitarian," says Pete.

I have followed the Israel-Palestinian issue very closely for a decade, mate, and the word 'humanitarian' could never be applied to Israel.

Unfortunately, most people, including yourself it seems, never take the time to investigate what is really going on in the West Bank and Gaza which is exactly what Singer wants.

That is why I list the Israeli atrocities and brutality and war crimes and genocide that are carried out under their illegal occupation as often as I can.

The last time Israel bombed Gaza they killed 1,400 people including 400 children. Their own losses were 9 of which four were from friendly fire. Then they restricted food and medicines.

Hardly humanitarian, old chum!
Posted by David G, Friday, 27 September 2013 7:37:58 AM
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Hi David G.

Are you at all interested in Syria's vastly worse human rights record that has lead to the deaths of more than 100,000 people over the last 30 months?

Try not to blame the Syrian Civil War on the US or Israel.

Racist slurs against white people are as intellectually dishonest as other forms.

Regards

Pete
Posted by plantagenet, Friday, 27 September 2013 4:00:37 PM
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Pete, are you interested at all in the fact that the Palestinians have been under brutal occupation since soon after WW2 ended?

Can you not see the difference between the civil war in Syria and the occupation of the West Bank by religious fanatics who see the Palestinians as sub-humans?

Do you know about the throwing of Palestinians into the streets with their furniture, the demolition of their homes and farms, the building of thousands of illegal settlements on Palestinian land?

Do you know about the torture that Israel employs, Pete, the keeping of Palestinian people in prison without trial, the ongoing humiliation of Palestinians at checkpoints, the control of Palestinian lives from dawn to dust, the over-flying of Israeli war planes day and night, the rumble of their tanks?

Do you remember the Peace Flotilla from Turkey where Israel killed 13 peace activists in International waters? Do you know how many U.N. Resolutions Israel has ignored with U.S. assistance?

Do you realize that most of the Palestinian population has never known a single day of freedom?

You may not care about this issue, Pete, but I do and so I speak out when I can!

To condemn the ongoing injustice is the least I can do!
Posted by David G, Friday, 27 September 2013 4:19:57 PM
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Hi David G

Yes I am interested in Israel's oppression of Palestinians. I have often referred to Palestine.

As David Singer wrote about Syria do you have the capacity to learn and comment about Syria outside of constant denunciations of the US and Israel?

Single minded repetition fails to convince people after a while.

Arguments that have some give and take have more impact.

Perhaps try writing an OLO article.

Pete
Posted by plantagenet, Friday, 27 September 2013 7:20:38 PM
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Pete, this headline might bring you up to speed. It shows that Israel bombed Syria recently so my comments about Israel re. Syria are relevant to Singer's post which, as usual, has a 100% pro-Israel bias.

"Israel Airstrike Targeted Advanced Missiles That Russia Sold to Syria, U.S. Says
By MICHAEL R. GORDON
Published: July 13, 2013. The Washington Post

WASHINGTON — Israel carried out an air attack in Syria this month that targeted advanced anti-ship cruise missiles sold to the Syria government by Russia, American officials said Saturday."

Interestingly, your comment shows not the tiniest shred of sympathy for the Palestinians and the sixty-year horror they are enduring at the hands of the Jews.

Are you Jewish or are you just a non-caring person who sees the world as a chess game?
Posted by David G, Saturday, 28 September 2013 7:54:42 AM
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Yes I do have sympathy for the Palestinians mate - and you for the Syrians?
Posted by plantagenet, Saturday, 28 September 2013 9:29:52 AM
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In the words of Mahatma Gandhi, between nieces and enemas:

"is time for peace bro" :)
Posted by plantagenet, Saturday, 28 September 2013 10:18:51 AM
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Trying to promote peace and do away with injustice is my mission in life, Pete!

Take care.

DavidG.
Posted by David G, Saturday, 28 September 2013 10:37:11 AM
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